4NCL North 2014-15

Venues, fixtures, teams and related matters.
David Robertson

Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by David Robertson » Fri Oct 31, 2014 3:59 pm

Mick Norris wrote:The Registration lists are out
Where? I can't see them. Maybe the interweb is slow reaching these parts

Alex Holowczak
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Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by Alex Holowczak » Fri Oct 31, 2014 4:03 pm

David Robertson wrote:OK. Can Alex now obtain for us the definitive, authoritative statement on which team in the triangular match bears which nominal letter? It wouldn't be unheard of for teams to turn up in two weeks time, assuming one thing, to find the arbiters had altered matters overnight, creating something else. Let's get it nailed down now. If as currently published, we run with that on the day:

A Holmes Chapel
B Spirit of Atticus B
C Jorvik
I have spoken to Dave Thomas again. He assures me that your assumption is indeed correct.

During that conversation, I can now pad out the other two details a bit more:

Colour: Normal colour rules apply. This means that, for example, there is no guarantee of 1 white and 1 black on a weekend. This was established as not being necessary at the captains' meeting, which is true, but I'd forgotten. That undertaking was given two years ago, and at the final weekend, a de facto playoff for fourth in Division Three was split because it would have meant one of the two sides involved had three of the same colour, and there were howls of discontent when both of them floated down.

Squad clashes: This conversation that still needs to be had between the Daves. This is true, but the round 1 pairings were fiddled slightly to keep apart two teams from the same squad. There is no such guarantee for following rounds, at least at this stage.

Alex Holowczak
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Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by Alex Holowczak » Fri Oct 31, 2014 4:07 pm

David Robertson wrote:
Mick Norris wrote:The Registration lists are out
Where? I can't see them. Maybe the interweb is slow reaching these parts
There is something strange going on with the website with regard to the registrations page. It doesn't work for me either, but it has worked for others. Some people found a list accidentally yesterday, which was never intended for publication.

They are available here: http://www.4nclresults.co.uk/static/4ncl/reglist.html

MartinCarpenter
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Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by MartinCarpenter » Fri Oct 31, 2014 4:46 pm

Interesting thanks. Helpful to know where we're paired in the triangle too. I'll let the people picking the Jorvik team know so we can try and keep it relatively sanely balanced.

MM1 should beat DCA C, but DCA C might well be quite a solid team this year. The odd player added to their squad and two down from the first team of course.

More Preston etc players not a surprise but I didn't realise Manchester's hinterland stretched all the way to Scarborough nowadays :)

Mick Norris
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Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by Mick Norris » Fri Oct 31, 2014 4:50 pm

MartinCarpenter wrote:More Preston etc players not a surprise but I didn't realise Manchester's hinterland stretched all the way to Scarborough nowadays :)
Well, if they won't let us join the NCCU, we might as well :wink:
Any postings on here represent my personal views

David Robertson

Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by David Robertson » Fri Oct 31, 2014 6:25 pm

I'll set the anoraks going by claiming that Spirit of Atticus is the only true 4NCL squad (ENG, SCO, IRL & WLS). We've also extended our 'reach' into Cumbria

Good to see every chess-playing Manc is now signed up. Though they'll be barred from eateries that ban coach parties (& hen nights). And, by the way, isn't Robert K Taylor one of 'ours'?

MartinCarpenter
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Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by MartinCarpenter » Fri Oct 31, 2014 8:35 pm

Preston says the ECF list so he must have drifted east :) They've got an awful lot of players from round there. Maybe a third of the squad? The people missing are the top Manchester players - even without 3C's they could have a very good team indeed if there was real interest there.

Suppose the top Div 1 teams might manage (more than!) 4 countries at times.....

Bradford DCA are clearly out to form a Bradford DCA 'York' team. They had three last season and had them all in one team for many matches last season (inc vs Jorvik). Added a fourth now :)

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IM Jack Rudd
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Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by IM Jack Rudd » Fri Oct 31, 2014 8:55 pm

Squads with players from at least four of the six nations in the BICC agreement:

Barbican: ENG, IRL, SCO, WLS
King's Head: ENG, IRL, SCO, WLS
Spirit of Atticus: ENG, IRL, SCO, WLS
White Rose: ENG, GCI, IRL, SCO

Robert Taylor
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Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by Robert Taylor » Sun Nov 02, 2014 8:15 pm

David Robertson wrote:I'll set the anoraks going by claiming that Spirit of Atticus is the only true 4NCL squad (ENG, SCO, IRL & WLS). We've also extended our 'reach' into Cumbria

Good to see every chess-playing Manc is now signed up. Though they'll be barred from eateries that ban coach parties (& hen nights). And, by the way, isn't Robert K Taylor one of 'ours'?
You do realise Dave: it's over 37 years since I had an 'Atticusectomy'?
True. Seems like yesterday I got that job over in the Peak District (where my daughter was eventually born).
These days?
More of a Grandad than a chessplayer - and most definitely in a state of unwork (retired).
Manticores?
They asked me!

Bob
<TciDdaNibLa>

David Robertson

Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by David Robertson » Sun Nov 02, 2014 9:25 pm

Delighted you're back! (in contact, that is) And welcome. If you're in Darlington, say hello. Thirty-seven years? Pfft! Merely a moment in time. :)

Robert Taylor
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Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by Robert Taylor » Sun Nov 02, 2014 10:06 pm

David Robertson wrote:Delighted you're back! (in contact, that is) And welcome. If you're in Darlington, say hello. Thirty-seven years? Pfft! Merely a moment in time. :)
You're on, looks like I'm doing that one. Maybe on the Sunday (at close quarters). By the way have you _never_ played Preston Congress even once? Shocking.
<TciDdaNibLa>

MartinCarpenter
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Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by MartinCarpenter » Mon Nov 03, 2014 11:36 am

Its a really nice event Preston. Sadly exiled from it by Yorkshire league matches most years :(

You know, looking at the Manchester/Bradford registration lists (and knowing a good number of the players) I think I'd take Manchester 1 as being very slightly stronger. Certainly little in it either way. NE1 a fair chunk stronger than either on paper of course, just whether enough of their top players turn up often enough.

Promotion likely to be quite tough for anyone. Bradford/Manchester should be a little stronger on 1 and 2 vs a lot of the teams, but not really underneath that and that really isn't enough for comfort over 6 boards.

David Robertson

Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by David Robertson » Mon Nov 03, 2014 6:15 pm

Triangular Match

Another one for Alex here. As far as I can tell, the pairings for these matches result in a 4-2 colour imbalance in all individual matches. All teams seem to achieve a 6-6 balance over the weekend, but not in the individual match. So, for example, Spirit of Atticus receive only two Whites v. Holmes Chapel, but four v. Jorvik, who in turn receive four Whites v. Holmes Chapel. When amplified by up/down floats, this gets distorting.

Unavoidable? I've no idea. If so, we'll just have to rub along with it. But surely a tweak is possible.

David Pardoe
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Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by David Pardoe » Mon Nov 03, 2014 7:16 pm

It will be interesting to see how that pans out...
How much advantage do you reckon having 4 whites might be.....perhaps it gives white a circa 10% advantage where both players are off level...?
And maybe knowing team players is wrong in this case, because players can prep up on the opponents.
Maybe for the triangular matches, and indeed all matches, there should be no advance notice of teams , and minimal prep encouraged...?
BRING BACK THE BCF

MartinCarpenter
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Re: 4NCL North 2014-15

Post by MartinCarpenter » Mon Nov 03, 2014 7:44 pm

If the teams are of equal strength, organised in terms of how they play and all sat down to play at once? Its a considerable advantage having the four whites. So much easier to control a game with the white pieces. Given the known circumstances - with playing half the match on each day - it'll be reduced somewhat I'd think, but still present.

I don't really see how anyone will be able to predict opponents! Lots of up/down floating of course, but also these teams really don't make it easy. Jorvik randomly pick their teams from a squad of 9-10 (and will vary from Sat to Sun), Holmes Chapel seem to like pulling their board orders out of a hat and no one (except David!) knows quite who'll be on Spirit 2 rather than their first team :)