4NCL North 2013-14

Venues, fixtures, teams and related matters.
John McKenna

Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by John McKenna » Thu Jan 30, 2014 12:17 pm

I am sure that, above, Martin meant to write signing up not 'singing up', but doesn't all this argument just highlght the kind of push-me-pull-you event the whole 4NCL is in danger of becoming due to its eclectic rules?

On the other hand, David Robertson made no bones about his view of playing in this particular division (4NCL North).

In his most recent post on this topic David said, "We (Spirit of Atticus) exist to play chess competitively, sportingly and convivially as a group of mutually supportive colleagues - that's what we mean by The Spirit. Absent any of this, we'd disband."

Absinthe (rather than "Absent") was what I thought was coming after "The Spirit", but no, and then I discovered why. David is strictly catholic in his taste for alcohol - at the start of the season he spouted, "Only one thing makes me apprehensive. As SoA Grubmaster, I'm in charge of 'entertainments'... You may think that should be no problem. Maybe not. But size isn't everything: I make my decision based solely on the quality of the wine list. Some things must never change (smiley emoticon)."

Yes, some things remain constant, as the poet has already put it -

The Grape that can with Logic absolute
The Two-and-Seventy jarring Sects confute:
The subtle Alchemist that in a Trice
Life's leaden Metal into Gold transmute.

(NB: There are, proverbially, seventy-two sects of Islam. There may end up being a similar number of 'sects' in the 4NCL.)

Finally, may I propose toasts for the next SoA bash - Confusion to the French/Spanish/whole EU!

MartinCarpenter
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Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by MartinCarpenter » Thu Jan 30, 2014 2:52 pm

Definitely no danger of my singing :)

Most of the 4NCL rules are extremely sensible. The tie break in Div3 seems a rather unfortunate choice given how 3N is structured. Hopefully it won't be relevant!

The disagreement is really the well known, very old, one about whether its 'right' to do what the rules of the competition tell you to do to win when that isn't what you'd normally call winning in an individual match.

MartinCarpenter
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Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by MartinCarpenter » Wed Feb 05, 2014 3:50 pm

Talking of generally sane rules, I just noticed that tie break is the rather saner sum of opponents match points. That removes the really silly things like purposeful defaults etc and means you can only ever contribute 1/11th from a last round match etc. I still wouldn't be overwhelmingly comfortable about it if involved in the last round.

Mind you, this makes the insistence on the all Manchester match rather more baffling because sum of match points in a swiss is inherently self correcting in the face of minor distortions in the field faced half way through.

Anyhow onwards to Buxton. The weather looks sufficiently unispiring to not tempt breaking out into walks instead of chess :)

Mick Norris
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Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by Mick Norris » Mon Feb 10, 2014 11:01 am

Interesting weekend at Buxton, hotel and playing facilities very good, and location excellent

Sunshine on arrival, storm when going for dinner

Chess results pretty much as expected I think?

Well done to SoA for winning the northern league

Anyone have any restaurant recommendations for Daventry?
Any postings on here represent my personal views

John McKenna

Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by John McKenna » Mon Feb 10, 2014 11:13 am

Thanks for that, Mick.
Just one question - that storm at dinner, was it in a teacup?

MartinCarpenter
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Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by MartinCarpenter » Mon Feb 10, 2014 11:45 am

No, it seemed quite keen on taking out the entire peak district :) A very good day to be playing chess rather than walking. Genuinely quite an impressive effort.

'Bradford' (Actually Sheffield, Hull, Leeds, York, York, Calderdale ;)) Knights B getting that drawn match against NE1 was probably the most notable semi upset. They actually had a very solid team this weekend though (maybe a little under rated FIDE wise too) and NE1 less so so not a huge surprise. (Bradford A might be rather strong next weekend.).

Very impressive to see how professional/determined Spirit A were in getting those 4.5 - 1.5/5-1 wins. A lot of quality grinding involved.

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Mike W. Richardt
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Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by Mike W. Richardt » Mon Feb 10, 2014 12:12 pm

West is Best usually goes to Abdul's in Daventry. Parking about 50 yards away.

The downside and that's perhaps the reason why it's not full with chess players on a Saturday night is that they don't serve alcohol.
On the plus side the portions are big and it has a nice atmosphere!!!

here is the tripadvisor link: http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Restaurant ... gland.html
Nullius addictus iurare in verba magistri - I am not bound to believe in the word of any master
http://www.mikerichardt.co.uk

David Robertson

Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by David Robertson » Mon Feb 10, 2014 12:15 pm

Quality grinding indeed! For the second 4NCL Sunday in a row, Spirit of Atticus players were again the last to leave the hall. In January, three of our 'B' team battled into the seventh hour trying to beat Ferry 1 (3-3). Then yesterday, four of our squad - two from each team - were hammering away deep into extra time. The 'A' team completed a (5-1) knock-out of the accomplished and tenacious Chedderton 2 by converting two awkward Rook endings; while the 'B' team added some slightly flattering gloss to a close encounter by turning over Jorvik (4-2).

The spirit in our squad this year is tremendous. It's a real pleasure to play with these guys. And as I've mentioned before, relations between the various teams are excellent too. I get the feeling the Northern League (Div 3N) has truly come of age.

Mick Norris
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Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by Mick Norris » Mon Feb 10, 2014 12:43 pm

Mike W. Richardt wrote:West is Best usually goes to Abdul's in Daventry. Parking about 50 yards away.

The downside and that's perhaps the reason why it's not full with chess players on a Saturday night is that they don't serve alcohol.
On the plus side the portions are big and it has a nice atmosphere!!!

here is the tripadvisor link: http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Restaurant ... gland.html
Although that would be good for our chess, I think it rules it out for the Manticores :lol:
Any postings on here represent my personal views

John McKenna

Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by John McKenna » Mon Feb 10, 2014 12:51 pm

MartinCarpenter>... A very good day to be playing chess rather than walking. Genuinely quite an impressive effort... Very impressive to see how professional/determined Spirit A were in getting those 4.5 - 1.5/5-1 wins. A lot of quality grinding involved.<

So, Martin, the storm passed and all's well that ends well.

No sign of a giant bust-up (I hope no ladies get the wrong impression.) as in -

Fee-fi-fo-thump
I smell the blood of a 4NCL ump(ire)
Be he alive or be he dead I'll grind...

No, let's not go there.
Hopefully, all is/are forgiven.

Congratulations to SoA and their 'Grubmaster' -

The mighty Mahmud, the victorious(-victualler) Lord,
That all the misbelieving and black Horde
(aka forumites)
Of Fears and Sorrows that infest the Soul
Scatters and slays with his enchanted
... wine Goblet?

(Sorry Prof, I promise to try not to do it again - at least for a while.)

MartinCarpenter
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Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by MartinCarpenter » Mon Feb 10, 2014 2:00 pm

I did opt out of that grinding a bit but then I do tend to have the killer instinct of a wet lettuce :) I'm sure you'd have coped. Impressed to see Andrew Mort rounding up Bolton players to go with the Chesterfield collective. Well connected.

Oh, to answer your off hand question about White Rose 3, its complicated! Within the bounds of Yorkshire both DCA Knights and WR are fully multi cultural. With the rules they can't be one big squad of course, and anyhow the odd semi local derby can be fun. I've tended to consider DCA Knights A as 'really' being WR3 but after they won that recent match I guess they have to be considered WR2, leaving WR2 as WR3 ;)

DCA B on the last weekend are basically what a solid Yorkshire Div3N team looks like.

I'd be very surprised if the players were there to form a formal WR3 team from scratch. Jorvik is already gently oversubscribed and more about fun - hence the heavy rotation etc - so not a good basis. DCA Knights C do seem to be a bit short on squad numbers so that, if DCA A/WR2 both stay in Div2, there might be a consideration for making them WR3 instead to get them a few more players/give the WR spares somewhere to play. The captains do all talk to each other so we'll see.

Nick Ivell
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Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by Nick Ivell » Mon Feb 10, 2014 2:11 pm

Thanks for the compliments guys. Rook endings are worth the study. Dust off your Smyslov & Levenfish!

My game had an interesting coda. In the allegro finish and move 60 reached, my opponent's clock was showing zero. Loss on time, therefore. My opponent objected, claiming that move 60 had some relevance. The arbiter, Alex, was on hand to point out the sad truth: when the clock shows zero it is game over. Message to everyone out there: no mysterious increment is going to appear, move 60 or otherwise. Clearly, we are still getting used to this new time limit.

As it happened I had already relaxed, with Lucena only a few moves away. It all goes to show that in the allegro, if you keep on asking your opponent questions, strange things happen...

I enjoy the chance in 4NCL to play games that have a beginning, a middle and an end.

Mike Truran
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Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by Mike Truran » Tue Feb 11, 2014 10:46 am

Here's another excellent Spirit of Atticus team report from roving reporter John Carleton: http://www.4ncl.co.uk/rep.spa3-1314.htm

E Michael White
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Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by E Michael White » Tue Feb 11, 2014 11:10 am

Nick Ivell wrote:My game had an interesting coda. In the allegro finish and move 60 reached, my opponent's clock was showing zero. Loss on time, therefore. My opponent objected, claiming that move 60 had some relevance. The arbiter, Alex, was on hand to point out the sad truth: when the clock shows zero it is game over.
Are you saying that your opponent made his 60th move on the board and it was then noticed his clock showed zero ?

Alex Holowczak
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Re: 4NCL North 2013-14

Post by Alex Holowczak » Tue Feb 11, 2014 11:20 am

E Michael White wrote:
Nick Ivell wrote:My game had an interesting coda. In the allegro finish and move 60 reached, my opponent's clock was showing zero. Loss on time, therefore. My opponent objected, claiming that move 60 had some relevance. The arbiter, Alex, was on hand to point out the sad truth: when the clock shows zero it is game over.
Are you saying that your opponent made his 60th move on the board and it was then noticed his clock showed zero ?
Last season, the time control was 40/120 + 20/60 + G/30.

This season, the time control is 40/100 + G/50 + 30s/move from move 1.

The normal 7-hour time control used in England is 40/100 + 20/50 + G/15 + 30s/move from move 1.

I suspect Nick's opponent confused all of this, and was expecting another block of time to appear that didn't.

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