4NCL North 2014-15

[Roger de Coverly]

I haven't done a detailed reconciliation but it's known that Wood Green 2 have dropped out of division 1, as have Bristol 1 from division 2. Thus Wessex and Brown Jack are reprieved from relegation regardless. There are a handful of new second and third teams in division 3, but unlike last year, new squads to the 4NCL are limited in number. Downend & Fishponds seem a new entry to Division 3, but are they just a replacement for the Bristol teams?

Last season, the all play all divisions had 32 teams. Adding Division 3 including teams that didn't complete the season takes it to 95.

This season, the aggregate is 94, reduced to 92 if "Ferry" are not participating.

(edit) The latest list shows 89 entrants, 84 of whom have confirmed and paid the entry fee. (/edit)

[benedgell]

Downend & Fishponds are the Bristol Uni team renamed.

[David Pardoe]

Disappointing to hear of the demise of Ferry....do we know why they have dropped out with both teams...?

I see Steve Kee was captain/manager of both teams last year.... so I`m guessing he felt unable to continue this year....and getting volunteers is always a tricky job.
I advocate that these teams should try to run with joint captain/vice captain, so that some of the load can be spread around...
Not sure how many players that Ferry had in there squad last year... with two teams this would need to be at least 16 players to be viable... If so, that might suggest there are about 15 floaters who might be seeking a team to play for..
If so, could `Spirit` (or someone....) create an extra team from the group who have disbanded...?

Here`s the group that David Robertson (somewhat tonge in cheek..I suspect) described as a `rabble`...

19 Graded players found. Include ungraded players

Ref Member Name Sex Age Club Standard Previous Rapidplay Previous
106747D Gold Bimpson, Tom M Atticus 172 A 180 A
107035G Boumphrey, Luke S M Atticus 167 B 172 A
103068B Gold Campbell, Ian M Aigburth 167 A 174 A
112355F Gold Hawkins, James NH M Aigburth 156 A 159 B
286095J Kee, Steve M Atticus 178 A 191 A
114021J Silver Lambert, John F M Atticus 135 A 140 A
215237L Lawton, Thomas M Atticus 110 A 115 A
114418C Lilley, Graham M Aigburth 172 B 184 A
286099F May, Natasha F Atticus 54 B 50 B
115786D Morley, Tony (AG) M Liverpool 142 A 141 B
242506D Odunaiya, A David M Atticus 184 B 183 B
104442E Gold Philp, Steven M Atticus 126 A 121 A
118971C Siddall, W Joe M Liverpool 172 B 165 C
292811F Smialek, Robert M Aigburth 82 D 83 D
270467F Bronze Stancak, Andrej M Atticus 182 C 186 C
277079K Stephens, Ian Paul M Liverpool 138 X 132 A 142 D 142 D
120918J Platinum Wadsworth, Mark S M Atticus 133 A 139 A
163166E Gold Williamson, Roger G M Aigburth 208 A 203 A
126943E Gold Wiseman, Jim K M Atticus 130 A 145 A

Looks quite a good squad to me... surely...surely someone could come forward to take this group forward..
Yes... the name Ferry might need a slight rebrand...maybe Merseybeats...but the pool of players looks quite sound for our Northern party... come on lads...and lasses. Yes, where are the lasses..
One concern I have with new arrangements re PUMA is the revised terms, whereby bookings must now be confirmed one month prior to the matches.. ie, no late cancellations.
I`d like to see an allowance whereby at least one player per team can cancel on short notice, to at least give some cover for late withdrawals.

[Mick Norris]

Disappointing to see a drop from 14 to 13 teams for 4NCL North, I would have thought that Ferry could raise at least 1 team

Will make it difficult for the Manticores 3rd team not to be outgraded often, and we'll no doubt see Manticores 2 v Manticores 3 at some stage

[MartinCarpenter]

Suspect he meant it actually - not of course in the case of being unable to play chess, but in organisational terms. There's some rather 'interesting' (depressing) history in Liverpool chess and for whatever reason Ferry didn't ever look super organised. Especially if you judge from the standpoint of Spirit who looked very organised indeed to me last season.

MM2 should have fair chances vs the third teams and NE2? Maybe even Jorvik actually, depending on if we get organised to have the weaker chunk of our players facing the weaker teams and the stronger vs the stronger teams

The thing that might produce a few more weaker teams playing would be when it goes all northern in a years time. Could see that getting one or two 'weak' Yorkshire teams out. The bottom division in the Yorkshire league really is struggling quite badly.

[David Pardoe]

If you look at the 4NCL Ferry reports on the Atticus website, it explains clearly what the problems were.
Steve Kee clearly struggled to raise teams due partly to player reliability/availability, costs...B&B accom issues, and transport....players with no cars...etc
You know these problems well, as do many captains...
Maybe Ferry bit off too much, and should have tried just one team...it looks a nailed on cert that they would have done ok, and there first team did get good results.
Transport....always a headache, even for the best organised.. Seems like no-one in Liverpool has cars...and they have a Vauxhall factory just down the road.....I jest.
And getting affordable accomodation...cheap B&Bs...much scouring of the web needed...sounds like Steve struggled with that one.
And to be fair to Ferry, the venues tend to favour other teams...being all located out of `day trip` range for the Liverpool teams. Maybe that boring venue near Crewe should be resurected, or somewhere nearby..
Anyway, if a way could be found to see a return of at least one of the Ferry teams, it would be greatly welcomed...
Could they raise a `late` entry and rejoin the northern party...

PS As regards the planned split of the Northern section away from the `south`...
I feel this is a bad move... the meetings of `north and south` in the Finals `banaza` weekend in May is a high point on the chess calander, which I think many players look forward to...and a chance to pop in and see the big guns of Div 1 battle it out for the top honours..
If only one joint meeting can be kept, that would be fine, I think....
Yes, I know we have outgrown the Hinckley venue so cant all assemble together, so it would seem...unless we could block book another nearby hotel...say the Best Western nearby. Or maybe, if a new Div 4 was contructed, with say 16 - 20 teams, then the top three Divs could assemble at Hinckley for the grand finals.

PS... If we were to have an extra Northern meeting, a good venue might be Harrogate..
One other thing I`d like to see looked at is whether some alternative `food offerings` might be possible..
Maybe something like a hotpot supper, a medium curry offering, or another `standard food` offering, like say, Lamb Shank or pork chops, Steak & Ale Pie..etc.. at a reasonable price... This might tempt more players to eat in at these hotels...and with such a large party of players to cater for...something aught to be possible, that also keeps the hotels happy...

[David Robertson]

Suspect he meant it actually...in organisational terms

Correct. Mick is too kind. 'Rabble' is exactly what I meant: a bunch of disconnected, shambling, leaderless individuals cobbled together by a well-meaning Stephen Kee.

One example will serve as illustration. For the first round last year in Darlington, our 'A's were drawn against Ferry 1. I was heading up our 'B's elsewhere in the room. After about twenty minutes or so, with clocks ticking, I noticed the Ferry Bd 4 had still not appeared. I'd seen the player much earlier in the hotel so knew it wasn't traffic delay. Bred of a concern that will become apparent, I asked a passing member of the Ferry team where their player was. I received a shrug. I asked another ten minutes late: same reaction - 'dunno; don't know if I need to know'. A further ten minutes passed - roughly forty in all - and their Bd 4 finally showed up. That player was Graham Lilley. He is blind, and these days, not too steady on his feet. He was accompanied though. But clearly something had gone wrong because Graham looked thoroughly stressed out. Had they got lost? Had some other mishap delayed them? I don't know. But I do have a shrewd idea. Accessing the playing room at Redworth Hall last year was possible either via some rather steep stairs; or via a lift in a nearby building that involved a long walk round the front of the hotel, and then negotiation of an unsigned labyrinth of corridors and doors before emerging into the playing area via a back kitchen. If Graham and/or his companion had come to the stairs, and balked at them for safety or similar reasons, they would have needed to retrace their steps and undertake a potentially arduous hike to the lift. This is what I think delayed them - because Graham finally emerged from the kitchen!

My point? No one in the Ferry team would wish hardship on Graham Lilley. But equally, if my scenario is correct as I believe, no one had the care or presence of mind to think/plan ahead, to walk the walk, to concern themselves with the totality of their number rather than their own individual needs. It didn't need to be a harassed captain: anyone and everyone will do. That's what distinguishes a rabble from a team.

Of course excuses/explanations are available: they were new to the hotel; they thought Graham's companion would cope; they misjudged the time involved in reaching the board; and the hotel was useless in facilitating access. Whatever, whatever. One thing is certain: such a state of neglect would never, simply never, occur in Spirit of Atticus. That's what our 'spirit' means: for each other, not yourself alone.

And the outcome? Graham Lilley lost in quick time. I'm really not surprised. Shameful.

There's some rather 'interesting' (depressing) history in Liverpool chess

Yes. And I'm not raking over it here (unless provoked). But one observation on the Ferry squad: of the nineteen, about half are decent folk, most of whom would slip easily into our culture if they chose. Among the other half, there are some mangled personalities indeed; we'd cross the road to avoid them. Stephen Kee never had a chance of making it work. No surprise that no one else is daft enough to try. And ask yourself: what sort of outfit is it that thinks the clunking title Ferry cross the Maroczy is, like, OMG so witty? An outfit with a collective brain-bypass, surely.

Anyway, a pity the best of them have folded. Hope they find another channel.

Especially if you judge from the standpoint of Spirit who looked very organised indeed to me last season.

We are. And we are because we care. And we care rather a lot about each other; about chess; about the 4NCL; and about our responsibilities to the collective good. Just as the 4NCL floats on the efforts of Mike Truran (but many others too), so Spirit of Atticus looks to the organisational and ethical leadership of John Carleton (supported by all of us). We don't do 'rabble'.

[David Pardoe]

David...I do like your team ethic....but I`m not sure you`re being entirely fair to Ferry..
Yes, the name is querky...and maybe you might say the same about Manchester...
We`ve been very lucky also to have some very good people running things.....and lets not mince words...its a fair challenge to get the show on the road.
Yes, Mike Truran and partners have done some good work in putting 4NCL high up the chess ratings....hopefully, they will continue this, assisted by some good guidance from the teams, captains, and various officials.
The Northern league has made excellent progress, thanks to a number of people who have promoted and supported this league in the North...and despite the difficulties and challenges...one big pat on the back to all concerned.
I can certainly see the issues with the Redworth ladyrinth, as you rightly describe it...
Yes, every team has its share of `unreliables.... but Ferry also has a core of sound players who surely would be an asset to 4NCL...it would be good if they could emerge from the rubble...
On the matter of players arriving late.... I do recall one situation where players arrived late for the matches, and I`m sure someone said something about getting the start times mixed up. They had been sat drinking in the bar, I believe, apparently oblivious to the fact that the matches had started upstairs.....
Lets look to better days....

[John McKenna]

Classic Dave Robertson, above, hitting all the right notes - even the dissonat ones.

David Pardoe>David [Robertson]...I do like your team ethic....but I`m not sure you`re being entirely fair to Ferry..<

As a split personality (far-north pa, southern ma, misspent youth in Stoke...), I'd just like to say that initially Ferry cross the Maroczy rang a bell by reminding me of the Jerry & the Pacemakers smash hit about the Mersey. The only way I could make more sense of the team name was when I thought of it in these terms - perhaps the team didn't have to give up the Sicilian because they found that, together, they could navigate the Maroczy bind?

I hope David R will pardon me, but the name Spirit of Atticus could be thought - by those outside the Northwest chess fraternity - to have some connexion with the 1975 film Dog Day Afternoon.

[David Gilbert]

I hope David R will pardon me, but the name Spirit of Atticus could be thought - by those outside the Northwest chess fraternity - to have some connexion with the 1975 film Dog Day Afternoon.

Dog Day Afternoon? To Kill a Mockingbird surely. Gregory Peck followed-up by playing chess in Guns of Navarone.

[MartinCarpenter]

They were merging two previous teams, so iirc the name was a fairly natural compromise The fact that they've collapsed from two teams to nothing does seem to say something. The player base might well simply be very hard to organise round a common purpose.

Spirit very clearly have that - getting a very strong NW team into Div 2 and keeping it there, with another team a bit more for fun but also reserves etc. Even Jorvik do actually - we've got the Yorkshire league (or WRose) to be 'serious' in, Jorvik is there to let people have fun without having to fully commit to a seasons matches. Hence our fairly extreme player swapping.

The most driven team I can remember playing in was York A in 2005/6. ~100 years of not winning the Yorkshire league but we'd done it the previous year and retained it using 9 players for 11 8 board matches. (and a tenth who played one game.). Its slipped a bit since then of course!

[David Pardoe]

As always, a great deal hinges on finding a captain.. There can often be a willing group sat in the backbround, just waiting for the right person to volunteer to lead the project.....

[David Robertson]

As always, a great deal hinges on finding a captain.. There can often be a willing group sat in the backbround, just waiting for the right person to volunteer to lead the project.....

The applause of listening senates to command,
The threats of pain and ruin to despise,
To scatter plenty o'er a smiling land,
And read their history in a nation's eyes

[David Pardoe]

Perhaps, perhaps not...
So many teams have fallen when there leader has departed.......and certainly not because they were `rubbish...`
Others, like Manchester have risen to the challenge...made there luck....
The county scene is littered with teams that `might have been...`
I suspect Merseyside is but one example......

[John McKenna]

I hope David R will pardon me, but the name Spirit of Atticus could be thought - by those outside the Northwest chess fraternity - to have some connexion with the 1975 film Dog Day Afternoon.

Dog Day Afternoon? To Kill a Mockingbird surely. Gregory Peck followed-up by playing chess in Guns of Navarone.

To: David G.

You need to delve deeper into the trivia trove -

In the film Dog Day Afternoon, Sonny, who is holding eight bank employees hostage, starts the chant, "Attica! Attica!", at the massed police outside, evoking the excessive police force used in response to the Attica riot. The chant "Attica! Attica!" has since been parodied or used for comedic effect in everything from children's cartoons to crime procedurals.[citation needed] (Wikipedia)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attica_Cor ... l_Facility

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attica_Prison_riot

Now, I admit that the name Atticus (Finch) of To Kill a Mockingbird fame is more memorable and that the connexion to place name Attica is a little hazy. Let's just keep following the links...

Atticus's name is a reference to the district Attica of ancient Greece in which Athens was located. In some way Atticus's rational approach to life is similar to that of ancient philosophers, especially the Stoics: "The four cardinal virtues of the Stoic philosophy are wisdom, courage, justice and temperance. All people are manifestations of the one universal spirit and should, according to the Stoics, love and help another, regardless of rank and wealth" (Encarta Encyclopedia).

http://www.123helpme.com/view.asp?id=4211

Perhaps Atticus Finch was modelled on Herod Atticus -

Born in Attica in 100 CE, and dying c.177, Herod Atticus was a philosopher, politician (as a senator in Rome) and patron of the arts... his bust was found in a tomb at Probalinthos, near Marathon in Attica. The same tomb yielded a portrait of Marcus Aurelius and another of joint emperor Lucius Verus, now in Oxford. This association was by no means fortuitous, for the philosopher Herod Atticus was both friend and teacher to both emperors...

http://www.louvre.fr/en/oeuvre-notices/ ... and-rhetor

So, there you have it - from ancient Attica, the birthplace of democracy, to the Spirit of Atticus chess team with some stops along the way.

How did the Liverpool chess club Atticus get its name, I wonder?