Chess Cafe Culture

[Jonathan Bryant]

"Undoubtedly if the Yorkshire constabulary wished to proceed with a criminal case against him, they should apply to the Dutch government with a warrant for his arrest and extradition."

Presumably, they would have held on to him in the first place, if they had wanted to proceed... Menashe Goldberg said he saw no reason to turn BE away from the cafe as he had never been convicted of anything.

They were proceeding. Eley legged it - which is very possibly *why* he was never convicted of anything.

[Stewart Reuben]

When I lived in New York in the 1960s there were, I think, 7 different chess 'salons' where one could play chess. There were also a number of coffee shops in Greenwich Village. Virtually all have disappeared. Presumably one can still play at Marshall Club, in Central Park and on Washington Square. The latter is one of the most famous activities in Manhattan.
When I was in New Zealand in 1995 there were three places for chess that owned their own premises.
When I was a youngster in London there was the Gambit Chess Cafe and the National Chess Centre. I was a bit young for The Mandrake Night Club where one could play. When that closed, The En Passant opened. There was also Prompt Corner in Hampstead.
Nos there are over 50 clubs, but none opening more than a couple of times a week. in the 19th Cdntury of course there were many chess salons.
As far as I know there are only two dedicated chess clubs in Britain, Hastings and Edinburgh.
I presume the decrease is to do with economics. For London we might be better off with just 10 clubs rather than 50 small ones.
Stewart Reuben

[Christopher Kreuzer]

When I lived in New York in the 1960s there were, I think, 7 different chess 'salons' where one could play chess. There were also a number of coffee shops in Greenwich Village. Virtually all have disappeared. Presumably one can still play at Marshall Club, in Central Park and on Washington Square. The latter is one of the most famous activities in Manhattan.

I have fond memories of playing chess in Washington Square. It was the only time I've ever visited New York, and I had heard about the chess hustlers there, so I went along and ended up playing a game for about $2 or something, and surprised myself when I managed to win with a rather nice sacrificial attack (and even managed to reconstruct the game later).

As far as I know there are only two dedicated chess clubs in Britain, Hastings and Edinburgh.

I've been to the Hastings chess club briefly, but not to the Edinburgh one. There are some chess clubs around the world that I would like to visit if I ever get the chance, and there are some other chess places that could be worth a visit. I'll start a new thread on chess tourism...

[Kevin Thurlow]

"They were proceeding. Eley legged it - which is very possibly *why* he was never convicted of anything."

As I said, "Presumably, they would have held on to him in the first place, if they had wanted to proceed".

I believe he was let out on police bail, not by a court, who might have "remanded in custody".

[Alex Holowczak]

If it isn't too long-winded, can someone explain what Eley did please? Some of us were born after 1975 here.

[David Sedgwick]

[Brian Eley] had been arrested by the Police given Police bail pending further enquries but had absconded and left the Country never to be seen in the UK again and thats well over a decade ago.
South Yorkshire Police must have had someone make a formal complaint about him for action to be taken.

These events - the complaint, Eley's arrest, and his subsequent disappearance - took place in 1992. I know who the complainant was, but I don't wish to name him.

The then BCF became aware of rumours surrounding Eley in 1980, and from then on he was never given any position at BCF level involving responsibility for juniors. My understanding is that at the time there was not sufficient evidence for the BCF to take any action beyond that.

[CliveHill]

Well ... thanks for all that. I certainly wasn't expecting a long digression on Brian Eley. All unknown to me as this was during my 'deep retirement'. I played him twice at Amersham with a score of one win each, sometime in the 1980s.

Never mind... back to the main topic. Thanks to Simon for reminding me about Chequers in Camden, and the various thoughts from various people about Amsterdam, Surbiton and points further north ... Stewart's transatlantic thoughts too!



I have made a contact with someone who used to work in the coffee trade, so that's one prerequisite at least!

[CliveHill]

So ... what are the basic objections to the idea of a fully-fledged chess cafe in (for the sake of argument) Greater London? Chess evenings in an already established venue might be a way of persuading an established caterer to start up/join in a venture, but I’m going to leave that to one side for the time being.

By the way, earlier references to ‘cuisine’ were not meant to imply Michelin-star status, just something a little bit above ‘greasy-spoondom’!

Argument number one. ‘Chess players would spend as little as possible on food and drink because the game’s the thing!’. That might be true of the really hardened club/congress crowd, but if the basic idea is to encourage casual/social players as well, and if consequently you are providing a relatively cheap outing/entertainment on (let’s say) a rainy Saturday afternoon, I think you would be able to make some money on the deal. Of course, as I said before, I do assume that the non-playing clientele would be the owner’s ‘bread and butter’; certainly in the early days of the venture.

Argument number two. ‘The general state of the economy is against it’. Perfectly true, but enterprises that come through a recession are usually in a good position to make progress when the business cycle swings the other way.

Argument number three. ‘We don’t need another small club.’ My assumption is that the cafe would simply be a catering/chess venue and not the basis of a club. The occasional blitz tournament might be an idea, but it wouldn’t be high on my list of priorities.

A few other points; I think the idea of hiring out the equipment to the regular chess clientele for a small fee is a good one. While I’m certainly not advocating ‘segregation’, the layout of the cafe would be quite important - perhaps a ‘T junction’ so that ‘the players’ could be shepherded towards the back of the cafe while the ‘punters/tourists’ could enjoy the delights of the front of the house.

In this day and age, I imagine a couple of PCs would be de rigeur (another small income stream?). The ICC might be less fun than playing with the waitress/waiter, but that’s life!

But ultimately, it’s got to be a question of location - reasonably central, but almost certainly outside the congestion zone - and getting the catering side right, because that is - literally - where someone could be making their bread and butter!

[Stewart Reuben]

the main problem is an entrepeneur. GO FOR IT.
S

[CliveHill]

Or as Captain Picard might say ... 'make it so'!

Will keep you posted on any developments.

C

[Justin Hadi]

Maybe Stelios might be interested? The EasyChessCafe brand is born!

[Sean Hewitt]

Maybe Stelios might be interested? The EasyChessCafe brand is born!

I know Stelios quite well, as those who know me will know. If you want to do it, I'm sure he will francshise the easy brand to you.

Which, by the way, would be easyChesscafe!

[Arshad Ali]

When I lived in New York in the 1960s there were, I think, 7 different chess 'salons' where one could play chess. There were also a number of coffee shops in Greenwich Village. Virtually all have disappeared. Presumably one can still play at Marshall Club, in Central Park and on Washington Square. The latter is one of the most famous activities in Manhattan.

In 2001, when I was in New York for three months, there were a couple of chess shops on Thompson Street, close to Washington Square Park, where one could play for $1 an hour without a clock, and $1.50 an hour with. When I visited NYC again at the end of 2006, both shops still seemed to be in business. The Marshall is also easy walking distance from Washington Square Park, and it was a place for good chess conversation as well as skittles back in 2001.

I understand chess cafes have been tried in London but haven't worked because London chess players tend to nurse a cup of coffee for hours. Maybe if a cafe were to charge along the lines of the shops on Thompson Street, it might be a viable proposition. Just barely.

[CliveHill]

Re. Stelios ... Well, I might indeed be looking for an investor; but are we really talking about a chess cafe, or a cafe with chess?

Thanks for the input (Arshad too).

C

[Sean Hewitt]

Re. Stelios ... Well, I might indeed be looking for an investor.

Sorry, you misunderstand. He wouldn't invest but he would allow you to pay him a fee to licence the use of the easy brand. It was a tongue in cheek response to Justin cause I can't see that being financially viable.