CJ Banned?

[PaulTalbot]

Its not reasonable to expect everyone to accept CJ's believes and therefore something less controversial in dress sense at an important time in our national chess would have been much wiser.

Copper in "doesn't quite get freedom of speech/equality issues" shocker.

I dont need lesson from a nob head about freedom of speech/equality issues I fought long and hard in the police service to promote them however most intelligent individuals recognise there is a time and place to support a particular issue. Our national championship is not the place.

I agree. CJ should be promoting chess, not his favourite pressure group. Don't get me wrong, I have friends who are Gay, but why do some Gay people feel that they have to constantly force this issue down other people's throats? I think they are the ones who need to "GET OVER IT", not people like me.

[Paul Cooksey]

Perhaps if CJ had stood up wearing an English defense League T Shirt or National front T shirt his freedom of expression would be acceptable?

I would object to those. I would consider them outside the political mainstream. But for example there are some causes, in support of the military for example, which I do not agree with as a liberal but accept are mainstream opinions. I would not object to a t-shirt supporting those.

[Jonathan Rogers]

The rules allow the arbiter ... - so they don't require him. So we are indeed in the realm of common sense. Surely the idea is that an arbiter might want to prevent someone from advertising a gambling website, to take one not particularly random example - but which sane arbiter/Congress manager would want to prevent anyone from giving some relatively inconsequential support to a charity (which almost by definition is accepted to be a good cause)?

The English Defence League is not a charity; I think that example is easily distinguished.

[JustinHorton]

I agree. CJ should be promoting chess, not his favourite pressure group. Don't get me wrong, I have friends who are Gay, but why do some Gay people feel that they have to constantly force this issue down other people's throats? I think they are the ones who need to "GET OVER IT", not people like me.

I didn't think we had parody accounts on here, that's normally reserved for Twitter

[Jonathan Rogers]

Universities have charitable status too. Would CJ have been banned if he wore the T-shirt of whichever University he attended?

[Simon Bibby]

Interesting to read.
Am a liberal expat liberal arts uni lecturer here, and an occasional player.
I simply object to T-shirts in professional settings.

I have strong views regarding the Japanese government's lack of consideration toward the people, and lack of action toward those people who live near the Fukushima nuclear incident.
But I wouldn't wear a T-shirt regarding this at a Japanese tournament prizegiving.
I'd wear a suit.
Time and place.

[E Michael White]

Maybe. But the human brain in a sane individual allows the application of commonsense. And the application of commonsense would start by asking whether the greater good in the greater round is best achieved by the applying the rule, or by tolerating its infringement.

As, in another setting, Blair and Brown discovered and generations will not forget. views like that lead to the financial crisis.

[Jonathan Rogers]

yes, I see the time and place point. Many would want to demarcate the roles. But to take that feeling to the point of actually banning CJ - that's a whole further measure. usually the powers that be would grimace and get on with it even if they didn't like it.

again, I think it relevant that Stonewall is a charity - not a political organisation.

[Christopher Kreuzer]

This is still all speculation until anything official is announced, but I would expect the following (in no particular order) to have some say in what goes on at the prize-giving in terms of appearance:

*The Congress Managers
*The Congress Sponsors
*The National Chess Federation

You would also expect individuals (such as local dignitaries and politicians presenting prizes) to have some opinion on what they are associating themselves with and being photographed with (whether those opinions are reasonable or not is another matter, but they can be expected to have opinions).

Not sure what, if anything, chess players, parents and arbiters have to do with this, though.

[Simon Bibby]

Do we have a description of the T-shirt from those present? Tasteful? A garish affair? Jimmy Somerville wedged between d5 and f5 pawns perhaps. Would work.
Whimsy aside.
Best not jump on this as a gay prejudice thing. Thought that had died a decade or two back, long gone, no? Nowt of the sort I would reckon. Just, yeah, don't promote other stuff. Smarten up, suit up, there's a good chap.

Perhaps money should be set aside for the prizegiving at chess events. To hire suits and shiny shoes. Clean socks. Deodorant. And shampoo and combs. Scruffy folk chess players, even more so than most of my American teaching colleagues.
Big fan of Morozevich, but nothing can excuse the dodgy, dirty white trainers he wore at the 2004 Calvia Olympiad prize giving. Stood in front of me on stage. Blighted the affair, he did.

[Andrew Camp]

Did the presentation perhaps deserve something a little more presentable than a t-shirt though?

I did think this.

[Roger de Coverly]

You would also expect individuals (such as local dignitaries and politicians presenting prizes) to have some opinion on what they are associating themselves with and being photographed with (whether those opinions are reasonable or not is another matter, but they can be expected to have opinions).

It could have been one ,or more, of the prize winners.

Do we have a description of the T-shirt from those present?

CJ is caught on camera as a spectator in round 11
https://picasaweb.google.com/1094989459 ... 6250735026

It's the (back of) the red tee-shirt on the far right of the picture about half way up.

[Carl Hibbard]

I'll make a comment whenever I feel like - I couldn't care less what you think because you're an idiot, Paul McKeown.

I'm just interested to know who actually banned him.

I would ask you pair to play nice and please attempt to be a little more civil before I am forced to take more drastic action

[JustinHorton]

It may be pertinent to observe that CJ wore a T-shirt and jeans at the opening ceremony. Nobody appeared to think this was untoward.

[Carl Hibbard]

It may be pertinent to observe that CJ wore a T-shirt and jeans at the opening ceremony. Nobody appeared to think this was untoward.

No just scruffy, I know there is no dress code and so perhaps I am just getting a little old