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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 8:10 pm 
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Alex Holowczak wrote:
Sebastian Stone wrote:
The problem as I see it is this. My performance last year was inconsistent, I did well in my club and badly outside. Using the current dating system my club games have been virtually ignored.

So this means that despite me performing at an average of 147 through 30 games I have had 15 games at an average of 135 bought forward. Now, I could change this so my club games are counted when the club season ended, which is the end of may. This dating system would involve 14 games at a 164 being bought forward instead.

This won't correct my grade it will merely make it wrong in the other direction. For one simple reason, last season I didn't play at 135, nor did I play at 164. I played at 147, and until that is recognised my grading is potluck based on dates.


The solution to this problem isn't the date of the game per se, it's not putting each game with its associated date. The problem is caused by having 15 games tied to the same day!


Instead of dates it will now be warped by form at the end of the season. :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:23 am 
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Michael Bennett wrote:
Ok, I have added a coloured border around each result, to tie them in with the games result pie chart below. Thanks for the idea Ian!


Your welcome Michael, I am amazed how quick the change was implemented! Once again Well done ECF Graders.

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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:01 pm 
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Richard Haddrell wrote:
Ian P Stephens wrote:
In view of the planned monthly updates, when would be the best time to report anomalies found for games already submitted?
As soon as possible.


Thanks Richard.

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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 3:50 pm 
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I would like to offer my congrats on all involved in the new online grading facilities

I did a quick Youtube video here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFAvF1dd5G0

Well done all involved

BTW Also of course the previous grading facilities were great too and much appreciated also - it's good it keeps evolving.

Cheers,
Tryfon

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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 1:49 am 
One slight problem with having new gradings issued halfway through the normal playing season is that some congresses have already produced their entry forms several months prior to the new grades being known. Some such tournaments (ie Blackpool) have stated that their sections will be based on the August grading list, although others do not include any such comment and just state that sections/grading prizes will be based on the "current grading list".

Therefore some players may have already entered a section under their old grade but now discover they are ineligible to play at that level because of an increase in their grade, or alternatively they might now be able to play in a lower section due to a grade decrease. In some cases there is a maximum grade limit to tournaments (ie "stars barred") and someone who thought they could enter an event now finds they are graded too high to do so.

Yes, in most cases it might be simple enough to change sections according to a player's new grade, but I already know of one situation where someone has booked a holiday at work in order to play in a certain event but now finds they are ineligible due to a change in grade and has now wasted those days' holiday. In another situation, a tournament is taking place in February and yet although the entry form was issued some months ago, the recently issued January grades are being used to determine which sections the players will be allowed to compete. Therefore some players may have entered not knowing which section they will actually be playing in.

Again, it might be simple to say that such congresses should state that gradings will be based on the list issued in January, but in one particular case I know of, the entry form states that there is a limit to the number of entries, so it might not be beneficial for players to wait until the new grades are issued as they might be too late to secure a place in the event.

I would have thought that any congress which issues an entry form before the new grades are announced should always have their sections based on the grades at the time of the publication of the entry form.


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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:36 am 
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Alan Burke wrote:
I would have thought that any congress which issues an entry form before the new grades are announced should always have their sections based on the grades at the time of the publication of the entry form.



I doubt there's yet a consensus on the "right" way to do it. Another issue is whether you use the "new" grades for pairing purposes. The "new" grades problem has always existed for Congresses at the start of the season, so there's some experience there. I think more events are now affected though.

This exercise has gone rather better than when the BCF tried it over ten years ago. By the time March came with no new grades, the BCF decided to scrap the whole attempt. Congress Organisers may well have decided to adopt a wait and see approach in case that experience had been repeated.


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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:46 am 
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I don't think it matters how you treat the January list, so long as you make what you do clear on the entry form.

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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 10:58 am 
Quite right Alex. The problem is that some entry forms just state "the current grading list" and although the forms were published several months ago, the congresses are now using the January list to determine their sections. I am just suggesting that all entry forms should state which grading lists are to be used so that players can make arrangements (ie whether or not to book holidays at work).


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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:13 am 
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Alan Burke wrote:
I am just suggesting that all entry forms should state which grading lists are to be used so that players can make arrangements (ie whether or not to book holidays at work).



I am curious to understand how ECF grading lists would determine someone's holiday arrangements: this is new twist that Otto Clarke surely would not have predicted?

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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:31 am 
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John Upham wrote:
I am curious to understand how ECF grading lists would determine someone's holiday arrangements: this is new twist that Otto Clarke surely would not have predicted?


Isn't it obvious? There's a national championship for players with grades at various levels. These take place over a working week. If you, or a family member have ambitions to win such a title, you have to take the relevant week off. If you plan on the basis of the earlier July list, only to find yourself not eligible because of the January list, you have a problem.

It's been a potential issue since the idea of grading restricted events was first introduced. In practice the annual July/August grades coincided with a slack period for Congresses. Also the holiday planning year usually runs from January to December, so previously you knew in the December of the year before your event eligibility and thus potential holiday plans all the way to August. Employers will sometimes insist on advance knowledge of time off plans for the main school holidays.


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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:46 am 
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A further complication is that not all holiday/work years are January to December. Some fit around various tax/fiscal year schedules.


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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:48 am 
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Roger de Coverly wrote:
Isn't it obvious?

I was thinking that players would decide to play chess on a certain date or dates and the grading list would determine which section they would enter.

In other words they would play anyway but I agree that certain events do not have sections for all gradings!

So, yes you are correct.

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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 12:03 pm 
John Upham ... To answer your query about holiday arrangements at work.

There is already a situation where a congress this February issued its entry form last year and someone with a certain grade and who normally works weekends has taken a few days' holiday in order to play in it. However, when the new gradings have been issued in January, that player has discovered that they are now above the grading limit for playing in the event because the congress is using the new grading list to determine its sections, yet the entry form stated it would use "the current grading list". However, by that, it apparently meant the list in force at the time of the tournament and not the one when the entry forms were originally issued.

Therefore that player has now wasted those days' holiday because the works have already organised cover for the days that the player was having off.


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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 12:26 pm 
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Alan Burke wrote:

Therefore that player has now wasted those days' holiday because the works have already organised cover for the days that the player was having off.


Could the player concerned have played in a different section or was that not possible or desirable?

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 Post subject: Re: New grades are out
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 12:33 pm 
John .. No, there wasn't an 'Open' section. The highest section was limited to a certain grade. Even so, a situation could still arise that a player might not wish to play in a higher section to what they originally entered (ie A player is towards the top of one section but now finds themselves towards the bottom of the higher section and without much chance of any prizemoney.)


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