Etiquette when reacting to draw offers

[Clive Blackburn]

Several times, while watching games between Masters or Grandmasters on the top boards of Open tournaments, I have witnessed the following:-

Both players are staring at the board in silent concentration.

Player A stretches out his hand and player B shakes it, saying nothing.

They then briefly discuss the game, very quietly as other games are still going on.

The surrounding patzers (such as myself) look puzzled and start asking other players if it was a win or a draw!

[ben.graff]

I was watching a game in the Leamington League last year, where one of the Leamington team (my team) offered a draw. His opponents response was, "No, but thank you for the opportunity." A touch patronising perhaps? (Needless to say our guy lost in the end...)

[Alex Holowczak]

Player A stretches out his hand and player B shakes it, saying nothing.

They then briefly discuss the game, very quietly as other games are still going on.

The surrounding patzers (such as myself) look puzzled and start asking other players if it was a win or a draw!

A similar incident happened during a Birmingham Rapidplay a few years ago. Unfortunately the players were speaking in Polish, a language which neither Dave Thomas nor I speak... We eventually got a result out of them.

[Joey Stewart]

Those damn russians... coming over here, taking our jobs and our women and then having the cheek to speak their language as well!! It makes me so cross.

[Clive Blackburn]

Unfortunately the players were speaking in Polish, a language which neither Dave Thomas nor I speak...

Looking at your surname Alex, I would have thought that there was a very good chance you would speak some Polish!

[Alex Holowczak]

Unfortunately the players were speaking in Polish, a language which neither Dave Thomas nor I speak...

Looking at your surname Alex, I would have thought that there was a very good chance you would speak some Polish!

Well, you would, but whilst my name is Polish, the ancestor it comes from was Ukrainian.

I know the names of the pieces in Ukrainian (and hence Russian, which is very similar), because I write in Cyrillic algebraic, which I argue I can because it's an official FIDE language. I know Queen in Polish is "Hetman", because the Hetman was the Head of State of the Cossacks for most of recent history, until brief Ukrainian independence in 1918 sort of made the title redundant. I can't recall the names of the other pieces at all in Polish.

[Niall Doran]

Anyway worthwhile relaying an anecdote from Keith's new book:

Arkell: "draw?"

Hebden (looking around): "where?"

[/quote]

Keith has a new book out? Is it any good?

[Andrew Bak]

I recently played a game and after the game, my opponent said he considered offering a draw to me but had read my musings against draw offers and so decided not to bother offering me a draw as he knew I wouldn't accept (which was true in this case!)

Mission accomplished - so far so good!

Of course he went on to give me a sound beating...

[Michael Jones]

Several times, while watching games between Masters or Grandmasters on the top boards of Open tournaments, I have witnessed the following:-

Both players are staring at the board in silent concentration.

Player A stretches out his hand and player B shakes it, saying nothing.

They then briefly discuss the game, very quietly as other games are still going on.

The surrounding patzers (such as myself) look puzzled and start asking other players if it was a win or a draw!

There was an incident in the Cov League a few years ago when player A reached out his hand without saying anything, player B shook it, A thought the game had been drawn and B thought he'd won. None of us really knew what the correct way of resolving such a situation was, so we just looked at the position, agreed that it was probably drawn and recorded that as the result. Player B grumbled a bit, but didn't bother pursuing the matter further.

[Greg Breed]

Several times, while watching games between Masters or Grandmasters on the top boards of Open tournaments, I have witnessed the following:-

Both players are staring at the board in silent concentration.

Player A stretches out his hand and player B shakes it, saying nothing.

They then briefly discuss the game, very quietly as other games are still going on.

The surrounding patzers (such as myself) look puzzled and start asking other players if it was a win or a draw!

There was an incident in the Cov League a few years ago when player A reached out his hand without saying anything, player B shook it, A thought the game had been drawn and B thought he'd won. None of us really knew what the correct way of resolving such a situation was, so we just looked at the position, agreed that it was probably drawn and recorded that as the result. Player B grumbled a bit, but didn't bother pursuing the matter further.

Usually when someone offers me their hand without saying anything I consider that resignation not a draw offer. If anyone did that to me I would ask if I was unclear. In this case I would clearly understand player B's grumblings, however if the position on the board is not an emphatic win then he should have confirmed the intention of the handshake.
To be honest it doesn't take much to offer your hand and say "Draw". Perhaps we would all do well to learn the "crossed fingers" sign of a draw offer used by the deaf?!

[Roger de Coverly]

To be honest it doesn't take much to offer your hand and say "Draw". Perhaps we would all do well to learn the "crossed fingers" sign of a draw offer used by the deaf?!

The official sequence is
play a move
offer a draw
press the clock

The opponent is under no obligation to accept or decline immediately, so a spectator unaware of the draw offer would just see a sudden handshake should acceptance of the draw require a certain amount of analysis.

[Bill Porter]

A year or two ago in the Middlesex League at the time control I spoke to my opponent about my adjustment of the clocks for a quickplay finish.

At his instigation we shook hands. He believed I had offered a draw while I believed he was resigning since I had an easily won game.
( I am oversimplifying; it wasn't quite as clearcut as it sounds )

Since the Middlesex League, unlike the NCCL, has an evidence based appeal system, I accepted the appeal verdict that the game was drawn.

Any suggestions for a good protocol for ending games at the time control?

[Alex Holowczak]

Any suggestions for a good protocol for ending games at the time control?

Yes, add the time when a flag falls, and not when you've made a certain number of moves, in accordance with the rules!

(Sorry, couldn't resist the opportunity to wind Roger up! )

[Alex McFarlane]

Yes, add the time when a flag falls, and not when you've made a certain number of moves, in accordance with the rules!

And which rule actually says that?

6.4 says that an arbiter checks the requirements of 6.3a (that the required number of moves has been made before the expiry of the time allowed) Is this one?
or 8.5 where you are only made to update your scoresheet after a flag fall.

I accept that both of these rules are open to the interpretation that you give. However, 6.3b states "the time saved by a player during one period is added to his time available for the next period". This is more in line with Roger's thinking than with yours.

Does a session end when one player has exhausted their time allocation for that session or when the required number of moves has been made. THe new glossary attached to the Laws for 2013 ismute on this point.

[Alex Holowczak]

And which rule actually says that?

6.3 Immediately after a flag falls, the requirements of article 6.2 a. must be checked.

...

6.2 a. When using a chess clock, each player must make a minimum number of moves or all moves in an allotted period of time and/or may be allocated an additional amount of time with each move. All these must be specified in advance.

I interpret these to mean that once a flag falls, you check the requirements of 6.2a, i.e. a player has made the number of moves in the allotted time period/time period plus increment. I.e. you check the time control has been met after the flag has fallen, rather than when you think you've made enough moves.

6.2 b. is nothing to do with the requirements of meeting the time control.

8.5. explains that the arbiters only stop play when a flag has fallen, and shouldn't dive in beforehand. If the clock takes it upon itself to add an hour to each clock, you could be stood there a while!