Swiss Pairing Software

[Roger de Coverly]

Vega and Tournament Director/UTU are the only programs that interface with the ECF grading system both for player input and output of grading files.

Hasn't there been some conversion software put together by the grading team which enables a FIDE rating formatted file to be input into the ECF grading system? Both would be using the same data on results, the change being to substitute the ECF grading code for the FIDE one.

[Gerry_Jepps]

Hasn't there been some conversion software put together by the grading team which enables a FIDE rating formatted file to be input into the ECF grading system? Both would be using the same data on results, the change being to substitute the ECF grading code for the FIDE one.

Yes, but lots of players, especially in non-FIDE-rated events, don't have FIDE codes. So the ECF processing system would have to make a best guess at the ECF code. Where several different players have similar names, it may guess wrong.

[Michael Flatt]

Hasn't there been some conversion software put together by the grading team which enables a FIDE rating formatted file to be input into the ECF grading system? Both would be using the same data on results, the change being to substitute the ECF grading code for the FIDE one.

All ECF graders make use of "BCF Result File Checker" which accepts either ECF or FIDE formatted files. The program also checks players identity and unique grading identifier against the latest ECF database, which itself is updated each month. The checker program is only issued to registered ECF graders.

The Chess Arbiters Association comparison of pairing programs is not entirely up-to-date. It doesn't specify which version of each program was reviewed or when.

Swiss Manager now accepts ECF grading lists (and many other national grading lists) and with a little ingenuity (i.e. a little reformatting) the ECF grading list can also be imported into Swiss Master.

Personally, I have no interest whether the program will or won't do British Unified Swiss pairings - I'll use whatever is available and is FIDE accredited.

[Roger de Coverly]

Yes, but lots of players, especially in non-FIDE-rated events, don't have FIDE codes. So the ECF processing system would have to make a best guess at the ECF code. Where several different players have similar names, it may guess wrong.

The impression I have is that Sean Hewitt and others who use Swiss Master have found a way to generate files compatible with ECF grading software. Perhaps it's the ECF grading software that can cope with FIDE formatted files. Even if the FIDE codes are faked, it will work if there's a conversion table between FIDE code and ECF code. Fake FIDE codes won't matter, if the data is only being input to the ECF software.

[Brian Towers]

Even if the FIDE codes are faked, it will work if there's a conversion table between FIDE code and ECF code. Fake FIDE codes won't matter, if the data is only being input to the ECF software.

The ECF grading database has FIDE codes for ECF registered players who have one.

Searching in the ECF database for Roger D de Coverly and then clicking on your ECF reference - 109494E - takes me to your profile which includes your FIDE code - 405213 and clicking on that takes me to your profile on the FIDE rating web site. Clever stuff!

[E Michael White]

Has anyone tested these software titles for fundamentals such as strong-player/whites bias and jam when the rounds/competitor ratio is high ?

[Michael Flatt]

Has anyone tested these software titles for fundamentals such as strong-player/whites bias and jam when the rounds/competitor ratio is high ?

With regard to the work undertaken by FIDE in specifying Swiss pairing rules and the accreditation of software it would be better to consult the FIDE Swiss Pairings Program Commission, webpage: http://pairings.fide.com/

The committee are currently redrafting the wording of the Dutch System Regulations. They invite comments: http://pairings.fide.com/documents/116- ... draft.html

Incidentally, IA Sean HEWITT, is a member of the committee. http://www.fide.com/fide/directory/fide ... =committee

All queries should be directed to the Secretary, IA Roberto RICCA, email: [email protected]

[Adam Raoof]

Hasn't there been some conversion software put together by the grading team which enables a FIDE rating formatted file to be input into the ECF grading system? Both would be using the same data on results, the change being to substitute the ECF grading code for the FIDE one.

Yes, but lots of players, especially in non-FIDE-rated events, don't have FIDE codes. So the ECF processing system would have to make a best guess at the ECF code. Where several different players have similar names, it may guess wrong.

I now use Swiss Manager for all my events, most of which are also ECF graded. I can confirm that the checker (created by Howard Grist) does a very thorough job of identifying players from the ECF master list. In order to generate a FIDE rating file from Swiss Master you usually have to have FIDE IDs or add dates of birth (or make them up).

In Swiss Manager, on the other hand, you can produce a FIDE rating file any time, even if data is missing. Since it is so easy to import the ECF grading list and the FIDE rating lists, it's only the occasional player that requires manual data entry.

[Michael Flatt]

I've come to the conclusion, based on hard won experience, that although Swiss Manager undoubtedly is a very capable pairing program it is just too inflexible to use with any confidence, except by those familiar with its foibles and workarounds. The fact that it so difficult to introduce new players and make other changes without reverting to an earlier backed up version of the database makes it virtually unusable. It is a real dinosaur of a program.

Swiss Master on the other hand is a dream to use in a tournament. It is so much easier to share the pairing task with another person, knowing that that any correction of misreported results and other changes can be made on the fly. A real boon in rapid-play tournaments.

[Alex Holowczak]

The fact that it so difficult to introduce new players and make other changes without reverting to an earlier backed up version of the database makes it virtually unusable.

This is so factual that it isn't a fact.

Actually, you can introduce new players and make adjustments to pairings without going to an earlier backed up version. Just enter the new player as you normally would, and then use "Set new player" - admittedly not a helpful submenu option that it took me a while to find - to make the adjustment you need to make.

[Michael Flatt]

The fact that it so difficult to introduce new players and make other changes without reverting to an earlier backed up version of the database makes it virtually unusable.

This is so factual that it isn't a fact.

Actually, you can introduce new players and make adjustments to pairings without going to an earlier backed up version. Just enter the new player as you normally would, and then use "Set new player" - admittedly not a helpful submenu option that it took me a while to find - to make the adjustment you need to make.

Perhaps, the sub-menus spread between top level menus Input and Pairings need to be re-organised to place them where the User might expect to find them!
There is also an urgent need for a User Manual that might helpfully lead a novice through the complete pairing process to include typical situations that occur when controlling a tournament:
(i) Introducing new players after the first round,
(2) correcting misrecorded results in earlier rounds,
(3) setting requested half point byes,
(4) cancelling half point byes when the player changes his mind (obviously before the next round draw),
(4) including manually repaired games arising from absence of players
(5) getting players not to turn up unexpectedly on the day after you have done the draw for the first round!
(6) getting parents to enter their children in the correct age category and not requesting transfers between tournaments after the first round!

Thanks, Alex. It is useful to know that such an option exists. I'll have to experiment with it.
This tit bit of information can make a real difference.

[Michael Flatt]

Using the Set Player option in Swiss Manager does allow a player to be added retrospectively, but when attempting to set a half point bye it appears to default to a one point bye. The process of correcting pairings in earlier rounds does seem unduly difficult and time consuming.

I think that I will stick with Swiss Master. I find it a much more helpful program in that it allows me to make corrections in a way that is more intuitive and in using it I am less likely to get something wrong in the middle of a tournament.

[Adam Raoof]

Michael - did you read the help file that I shared with you? It answers these questions and more!

[Michael Flatt]

Michael - did you read the help file that I shared with you? It answers these questions and more!

Adam, thanks for reminding me. The trouble is I don't like to keep going back to the notes.
Perhaps, I am not using the program sufficiently often to remember what the process is.

Also, it is embarrassing trying to show someone else how to use it and forgetting how to do it myself.

[Alex Holowczak]

When I set the tournament up, I deliberately set the option to allow the manual input of the result of a player with the bye, or players excluded from the pairings. That avoids the problem.