Chess club folds

[Stewart Reuben]

Bruce was a witty man. I played at Bognor while still a teenager. He was The Times correspondent for the event. I made some sort of riposte to him. He said, 'I'll spell your name incorrectly in The Times tomorrow because of that. And The Times is the journal of record, so what is written there is correct.' The following day my name was indeed spelled incorrectly. Such errors have plagued me ever since.
We met when 'Cabbage Heads and Chess Kings' came out. He sked me what I thought of the book. A grave mistake. I responded, 'Perhaps it should be called, 'A Cabbage Head among the Chess Kings.'

But I don't remember what happened to him. He is not in Harry Golombek's Encyclopedia. I suppose he eventually retired and I failed to notice his obituary, or have forgotten.

[John Saunders]

Hendy Bruce Hayden, born 7 April 1907, Glasgow, died 25 October 1997, Kingston-upon-Thames.

My initial source for most of this (including Hayden's unusual and used first name) was Ken Whyld's Quotes & Queries in BCM in Sept 2001 (when I was editor). In fact, Ken acknowledged Brian Denman as the real source of info. All apart from the place of his death, which I have just gleaned from ancestry.com.

(This has been discussed before on the forum - see here)

[Gordon Cadden]

I am sure I met Miss Price at The Gambit when a teenager. When it closed down, the En Passant was opened by Boris Watson in the Strand. We often played there in the lunch-time being at King's College.
Neither ever played as team-playing club. The EP became a poker joint as well. It closed when the casino industry became more regulated.
The Mandrake has yet to be mentioned. That was a night club in London that I was too young to visit. They played chess there.

It is rather ridiculous I have never been a member of Richmond & Twickenham Chess Club. I've lived here since 1973.

Okay, I will mention the Mandrake, if only to help that young historian, Christopher Kreuzer. The club was owned by Harold Lommer (not certain if he was in partnership with someone else), who was an endgame expert known worldwide. In 1938, Printing Craft Limited, published 1234 Modern Chess Endings, compiled by M.A.Sutherland and H.M.Lommer. This may be the first UK book published using only Algebraic Notation(Problem books excluded). Modern Editions of this book have been issued.
The chess room was at the rear of the night club. Because of Lommer's reputation, it did attract strong players. Know that MJ Franklin and RG Wade attended regularly, as did visiting European Masters.
Youngsters were not encouraged to visit, because one had to mingle with ladies of the night, before reaching the chess room. Harold Lommer decided to retire to Spain in the mid-sixties, but the premises did continue as a drinking club. The club was in Soho - Frith Street, as I recall.

According to Bruce Hayden, in "Cabbage Heads and Chess Kings", the Mandrake Club was in Meard Street. Lommer was in partnership with Boris Watson. William Winter, Imre Konig, Ernest Klein, Herman Steiner, Ossip Bernstein, Harry Golombek, Alexander Distler, and Walter Veitch, could also be seen at the Mandrake. Quite a gathering of players, mostly Kings.

[Mike Gunn]

Dragging the thread back to the original topic ... Addlestone won divisions 1, 2, and 3 of the Surrey Border League in 2006 and a few years later disappeared leaving no discernible trace.

[David Robertson]

I've been following this thread with interest; but with rueful weariness too. It could easily be a microcosm of the future of the game in this country. (Or, indeed, of the country. Period)

The thread opened with news of a club folding in the North-East. That, in my opinion, is a sign of things to come; its significance worthy of thoughtful discussion in its own right. After all, as things stand, a club folding in the NE may never re-open nor re-emerge as something else.

But the thread soon moved on, and as night follows day, before long we are discussing the comings and goings of clubs in Surrey and London/SE. All very interesting, I suppose - certainly for those of a certain age in the areas concerned.

Rather missing the point though. If we were to construct a similar thread in fifteen years' time, clubs would still be coming and going in Surrey and the SE. But in the NE, clubs will have gone. Just folded - for want of players, organisers and so forth.

My point? A club folding in the NE needs to generate more than a shrug from players in Surrey. Why? Because if it doesn't, pretty much all we'll have left in fifteen years time are clubs in the SE. Think about it.

[Roger de Coverly]

My point? A club folding in the NE needs to generate more than a shrug from players in Surrey. Why? Because if it doesn't, pretty much all we'll have left in fifteen years time are clubs in the SE. Think about it.

I have thought about it. Clubs in the North East are hotbeds of enthusiasts for compulsory ECF membership, whereas most of the South remain sceptics. If you put up barriers to new players, it's long seemed obvious to me that you discourage them.

[MartinCarpenter]

Not sure which Cleveland team folded but most of them are actually fairly tightly packed geographically in/around 'Boro. Suspect major long term issues if the next few decades treat poor 'Boro as horribly as the last few Should at least be plausibly resilient to specific clubs folding.

The Durham league really did worry me last year. Only 5 teams finishing the top division in the end, and two of those suffering.

They lost Consett - and there really isn't anything anywhere near there as a back up. There was also a very strong Newcastle team was trying outreach activities but folded due to a lack of drivers (players rescued in the Northumbria league, not Durham). I'm seriously impressed that Gateshead kept fielding a team actually. Truly terrible luck.

Up to 6 this season it seems, because Peterlee's stronger players seem to be joining in. (iirc they're refugees from the Cleveland league due to some especially silly dispute.). It isn't good long term. Don't know about the Northumbria (Newcastleish) league, but Newcastle is massive and doing OK for itself so it should be healthy enough.

I don't remember huge numbers of compulsory membership millitants (or even any!) The Cleveland league are very, very keen on rules mind.

[David Robertson]

I have thought about it. Clubs in the North East are hotbeds of enthusiasts for compulsory ECF membership, whereas most of the South remain sceptics. If you put up barriers to new players, it's long seemed obvious to me that you discourage them.

With respect, 'thinking about it' requires more than ramming a problem through your well-worn conceptual mincer. You assume the NE generates a continuous supply of players ready to be discouraged.

I'm arguing that the supply of players in the NE is running dry; the well-spring is failing. This is for structural reasons, not for lack of effort by the local chess community. By contrast, Surrey continues to generate a plentiful supply of players, largely (but not of course entirely) irrespective of local effort.

[Roger de Coverly]

not for lack of effort by the local chess community.

I thought they devoted their efforts towards devising rules to discourage new players. It's nothing new, they've being doing it for years, particularly in Cleveland.

[Mick Norris]

I'm arguing that the supply of players in the NE is running dry; the well-spring is failing. This is for structural reasons, not for lack of effort by the local chess community. By contrast, Surrey continues to generate a plentiful supply of players, largely (but not of course entirely) irrespective of local effort.

My impression from discussions with NE and Cumbria people is that the large geographical counties are a problem when you lose, say, a key captain - they appear to be trying hard to generate new junior players

In Manchester, clubs have always come and gone, and will continue to do so, but the large population means that clubs are easier to sustain (2 of our weakest clubs, my own included, have found some new players recently that may save the clubs from dying out)

I suppose we need to bring players back to over the board chess (i.e. concentrate on Seniors) as well as bringing players through (i.e. juniors and finding a path to them remaining adult players, although as lots of them get sucked down to the SE for work, it isn't easy) - I'm not sure if the ECF has a coherent strategy

[MartinCarpenter]

The Cleveland league definitely has some issues but Durham seemed like a very sensibly run league and Northumbria might well be.

Like David says, its just that the demographics aren't great. They're especally cruel to 'Boro/the Cleveland league of course

The Durham league perhaps isn't suffering so terribly from that, but it does have the combination of natural shrinkage and spread out clubs, which really isn't at all good. There's no population base at all. Long term could see it folding with Durham playing vs the teams round Newcastle.

Darlington is actually doing fairly well for itself in terms of players - and even some juniors - which is probably related to its surviving a bit better economically than some places round the NE. There is, I suppose, some danger it might find itself stranded at some point.

[Jonathan Bryant]

I'm arguing that the supply of players in the NE is running dry; the well-spring is failing. This is for structural reasons, not for lack of effort by the local chess community. By contrast, Surrey continues to generate a plentiful supply of players, largely (but not of course entirely) irrespective of local effort.

Without doubting your structural hypothesis David, what’s going on in the North East that’s not happening in Surrey? Or vice versa?

[MartinCarpenter]

All sorts of things, not so many relevant Mostly, there's just a much lower density of people than there is even in central Yorkshire let alone Surrey/London.
(The terrible medium term economic suffering in some of these places can't help of course ).

[David Robertson]

Without doubting your structural hypothesis David, what’s going on in the North East that’s not happening in Surrey? Or vice versa?

I suspect you know really, Jonathan. But it's the right question to ask. As Socrates said (do take my word for it): "ask not of the wise what they know; seek instead the wisdom in oneself. There lies understanding"

[Neill Cooper]

Without doubting your structural hypothesis David, what’s going on in the North East that’s not happening in Surrey? Or vice versa?

Surrey has a Secondary school chess league?