Strange example of gamesmanship in play

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MJMcCready
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Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by MJMcCready » Sat Jul 29, 2017 10:49 am

Greetings, so I went to the chess and bridge center yesterday for, perhaps, the first time in many years. Two guys were playing outside and in the midst of a rook endgame. They weren't using a clock but then one of them did something which you don't see very often, and frankly, I wasn't so sure what he was playing at.

So he played, as black, the move Ra1. His rook was on a5, and to execute such a move shouldn't take more than a second as you are only moving it over four squares but he decided to move the rook on the board and very very slowly indeed, presumably to annoy his opponent. It took him about half a minute to move the rook from a5-a1. He was smiling as he did it, and I could see he was just trying to wind his opponent up. So my question is that if this happened in a rated game, is deliberately moving your piece [or pawn] for that matter as slowly as possible against the rules? Some people deliberately move slowly always but when they are taking 10 seconds or more just to make one move, that would annoy anyone.

Just thought I would ask.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by Roger de Coverly » Sat Jul 29, 2017 12:21 pm

MJMcCready wrote:So my question is that if this happened in a rated game, is deliberately moving your piece [or pawn] for that matter as slowly as possible against the rules?

Only if you can make a case that it distracts the opponent.
11.5
It is forbidden to distract or annoy the opponent in any manner whatsoever. This includes unreasonable claims, unreasonable offers of a draw or the introduction of a source of noise into the playing area.

11.6
Infraction of any part of Articles 11.1 – 11.5 shall lead to penalties in accordance with Article 12.9.
The other potential annoyance is where someone picks up a piece, and holds it in the hand while deciding where to place it.

NickFaulks
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by NickFaulks » Sat Jul 29, 2017 12:34 pm

MJMcCready wrote: They weren't using a clock
That is the beginning and the end of the story. He can do whatever he likes, since the game has no official meaning. If you don't like it then don't play him again or, if you are seriously annoyed, just walk away. It isn't worth an argument.
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LawrenceCooper
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by LawrenceCooper » Sat Jul 29, 2017 12:39 pm

NickFaulks wrote: if you are seriously annoyed, just walk away. It isn't worth an argument.
Many a forum thread could have been prematurely ended with that logic :wink:

Richard Bates
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by Richard Bates » Sat Jul 29, 2017 12:42 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
MJMcCready wrote: They weren't using a clock
That is the beginning and the end of the story. He can do whatever he likes, since the game has no official meaning. If you don't like it then don't play him again or, if you are seriously annoyed, just walk away. It isn't worth an argument.
You missed the bit that said
"if this happened in a rated game..."

NickFaulks
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by NickFaulks » Sat Jul 29, 2017 12:54 pm

Richard Bates wrote: You missed the bit that said
"if this happened in a rated game..."
Actually I didn't, but why would anyone care if an opponent used his clock time to wave a piece around in the air? Do you have a right of unrestricted view of the board while your opponent's clock is running? On reflection, perhaps you do.
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Richard Bates
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by Richard Bates » Sat Jul 29, 2017 1:00 pm

In a blitz or a rapidplay game considerable confusion can be created if a piece is picked up from its original position and the move not rapidly completed. Not least because in time pressure it can become quite difficult remembering what the original position was! Which then leads to a reasonable likelihood of illegal moves being made and not being easily challengeable.

Ian Thompson
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by Ian Thompson » Sat Jul 29, 2017 1:10 pm

NickFaulks wrote:Actually I didn't, but why would anyone care if an opponent used his clock time to wave a piece around in the air? Do you have a right of unrestricted view of the board while your opponent's clock is running? On reflection, perhaps you do.
I don't think there's any doubt at all that you do.

The only rule I can think of that gives the player to move rights that the other player does not have is rule 4.2.1 (adjusting pieces).

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MJMcCready
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by MJMcCready » Sat Jul 29, 2017 2:05 pm

I think the thing was, he was sliding the rook down the board and gauging the reaction all the way. He knew what he was doing although his opponent remained unflustered thankfully.

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MJMcCready
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by MJMcCready » Sat Jul 29, 2017 2:08 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Richard Bates wrote: You missed the bit that said
"if this happened in a rated game..."
Actually I didn't, but why would anyone care if an opponent used his clock time to wave a piece around in the air? Do you have a right of unrestricted view of the board while your opponent's clock is running? On reflection, perhaps you do.
Well, if they are staring at you whilst doing it to see if you are annoyed and then carry on, you'd care then. He didn't annoy his opponent but as mentioned, it was a friendly game. I wanted to know what could happen if it was a rated game. That's all.

David Sedgwick
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by David Sedgwick » Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:21 am

NickFaulks wrote:Actually I didn't, but why would anyone care if an opponent used his clock time to wave a piece around in the air? Do you have a right of unrestricted view of the board while your opponent's clock is running? On reflection, perhaps you do.
Ian Thompson wrote:I don't think there's any doubt at all that you do.
I agree completely with Ian.

Moreover, you have a right to see the correct position on the board. If I pick up my queen and hold it under the table, my opponent is looking at a position in which he appears to be a queen up and has to remember which square it was on. As Richard Bates said, that could be particularly problematic in a Rapid or Blitz game.

David Williams
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by David Williams » Sun Jul 30, 2017 1:44 pm

I believe the rule about not writing down a move before you made it was done on the grounds that it was making notes. For me that wasn't a problem, but I always had the distinct impression that some people did it in the expectation that their opponent would read it upside down, and they could try to gauge any reaction - and without even touching a piece.

Geoff Chandler
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Re: Strange example of gamesmanship in play

Post by Geoff Chandler » Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:47 pm

Somehow this reminds me of Tal in reply to Fischer's 1.e4 paused with the pawn on
c6 as if to play a Caro Kann and then slide it to c5. Fischer is quite unimpressed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLajvvPMdok