ECF National Counties Rapidplay and Handicap Rapidplay

[Adam Raoof]

ECF National Counties Rapidplay and Handicap Rapidplay

Does anyone have details about how much teams were charged to play each event the last time they were run, how many entered and what number of boards the events were run over?

[John Philpott]

The Counties Team Rapidplay, with a handicap prize incorporated in the main event, was last held on 21 April 2007 in Hertfordshire, alongside a junior event, when it attracted four entries and was won by Kent. The event has always, to the best of my knowledge, been contested over twelve boards. I cannot immediately track down the entry fee for the 2007 event, although I remember thinking at the time that it was higher than I would have expected. The fee was £24 when the event was held at The King's School Gloucester in September 2002.

[Kevin Williamson]

The competing teams were Kent, Hertfordshire, Cambridgeshire and Bedfordshire. It was run as an all play all over 12 boards, with 30 minutes each per player per game.
Kent were very strong and won easily (including a 12-0 win in one match).

The handicap was calculated on predicted score based on average grade. We (Bedfordshire) were the weakest team, but won against Cambs, and 'only' lost 3.5-8.5 against Kent, and won the handicap. I recall that the handicap trophy had gone missing before the event and was not presented, so please don't blame us for losing it!

From memory I think the entry fee was around £30 per team as. like John, I recall thinking it was a little high.

[Adam Raoof]

From memory I think the entry fee was around £30 per team as. like John, I recall thinking it was a little high.

Surely an event over 12 boards with six games in a day is worthy of a higher entry fee - not a lower entry fee? If you played in a one-day rapidplay you wouldn't expect to pay £2!

The City of London Rapidplay League was run at cost at about £35 a team. http://citychess.blogspot.com/

I am in discussions with organisers about holding these events in 2010. Without sponsorship I would expect any organiser taking this event on to charge each team about £120, and leave it to the Captains to recoup the money as they saw fit from their squad.

[John Philpott]

Adam Raoof wrote

Surely an event over 12 boards with six games in a day is worthy of a higher entry fee - not a lower entry fee?

If that is what you are intending, we are looking at a somewhat different event from the one that has been run previously. Gloucester in 2002 was four rounds with 25 minutes per player. Spondon in 2003 was five rounds with 20 minutes per player. As Kevin did not specify "double round" I am assuming that 2007 was just three rounds.

Adam Raoof wrote

Without sponsorship I would expect any organiser taking this event on to charge each team about £120, and leave it to the Captains to recoup the money as they saw fit from their squad.

As a matter of interest, what number of entries is the £120 predicated upon?

[Adam Raoof]

The competing teams were Kent, Hertfordshire, Cambridgeshire and Bedfordshire. It was run as an all play all over 12 boards, with 30 minutes each per player per game.
Kent were very strong and won easily (including a 12-0 win in one match).

The handicap was calculated on predicted score based on average grade. We (Bedfordshire) were the weakest team, but won against Cambs, and 'only' lost 3.5-8.5 against Kent, and won the handicap. I recall that the handicap trophy had gone missing before the event and was not presented, so please don't blame us for losing it!

From memory I think the entry fee was around £30 per team as. like John, I recall thinking it was a little high.

Kevin said it was 12 boards and 4 teams. If you had more teams you would run a swiss event, probably of six rounds. I would expect it to be 30 minutes per player per game.

For six games of half hour chess, I think £10 a head is very reasonable, and takes into account a prize fund, hire of a suitable premises, game fee and cost of an arbiter for the tournament, publicity and promotion and anything else I have forgotten!

It is not predicated on any particular number of entries, but we should also bear in mind that anyone taking on such a commitment will want the opportunity to make a profit, and the ECF will want the guarantee of a good event at no net cost!

[Nick Thomas]

Hi Adam. I think an important question to ask is do teams of county players want to play county chess for a day at a cost of a tenner per head. I'm just not sure it's what players want to do any more...

[Adam Raoof]

I think an important question to ask is do teams of county players want to play county chess for a day at a cost of a tenner per head.

Nik, take the word 'county' out of that sentence. Does it scan any better?

[Adam Raoof]

I think an important question to ask is do teams of county players want to play county chess for a day at a cost of a tenner per head.

Nick, take the word 'county' out of that sentence. Does it scan any better?

[Adam Raoof]

I think an important question to ask is do teams of county players want to play county chess for a day at a cost of a tenner per head.

Nick, take the word 'county' out of that sentence. Does it scan any better?

[Ian Kingston]

I suspect it's not the tenner - it's the travelling. A local event is one thing; a 400 mile round trip is quite another.

It could be regionalised, with a national final, but that's another day to be squeezed into the calendar. My feeling is that rapidplay is just not worth the bother for most people.

[Nick Thomas]

It is of course partly the travelling but the county thing is important as well. To raise a county team means encouraging a group of players from a finite pool to compete on a particular day, to travel sometimes long distances and pay a fee. I doubt that there is an appetite for this. Encouraging 100 players to play in an individual rapidplay is one thing (you might have a pool of a thousand or so local (ish) players to pitch it to) but if you managed to get 10% of your active county team players keen on a team event you might end up with only 2!!

The 4NCL is similar in some respects and of course enormously successful but relies on fantastic venues, low fees and great quality "proper" chess....

[John Philpott]

There is a practical point, related to the travelling issue that Ian Kingston touches on, which needs to be brought out and which is equally relevant to the way in which the National Club Rapidplay is organised. Adam Raoof refers to six rounds of 30 minutes per player per game, which is the basis on which he organises the excellent Golders Green Rapidplays. However, a 10.30 a.m. start and a 5.45 p.m. finish may be entirely appropriate for an event at Golders Green which is drawing the majority of its entrants from London and the South East. However, a national event should be seeking to draw entries from the whole country: for example, if it is held in the SCCU area you would want Yorkshire to enter. Given the distance involved, a 10.30 a.m. start does not seem likely to encourage their participation. A combination of a later start and some truncation of the number of rounds, or round length or both may therefore have merit.

[Adam Raoof]

Darn it, you are all so sensible.

OK, have it in a decent hotel, with participants staying the night (Saturday) before the event (=good venue), and a relatively early start (=early finish) so players can get back to [insert home address]?

Five rounds, that would be enough.

[Alex Holowczak]

Darn it, you are all so sensible.

OK, have it in a decent hotel, with participants staying the night (Saturday) before the event (=good venue), and a relatively early start (=early finish) so players can get back to [insert home address]?

Five rounds, that would be enough.

This format seems somehow familiar...