ECF Office

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
Stewart Reuben
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Stewart Reuben » Wed May 09, 2012 9:40 pm

Islington 1973 was bigger, 1500 players as against 1200 in 1972. It relied on the Fischer boom for that. Also that the Evening Standard sponsored and publicised both events and that additionally Guardian Royal Exchange Assurance sponsored 1973. Also england got its act together at that time better than any other federation.
The number of entry forms distributed was prodigious.
It is of course true that you can now publicise your events on the internet. The prime source for English events is the ECF website. But people like also to receive direct communication and a tied membership enables that - as in the US.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu May 10, 2012 8:30 am

Stewart Reuben wrote: Also england got its act together at that time better than any other federation.
It must have helped that unlike many other countries, there wasn't the barrier to entry of needing membership of the national federation.
Stewart Reuben wrote: The prime source for English events is the ECF website.


Personally I would Google directly for the event website.
Stewart Reuben wrote: But people like also to receive direct communication and a tied membership enables that - as in the US.
If as an event organiser, you want to reach new players, a tied membership does nothing for you. In any event the ECF declined to create a USCF style structure. Had it done so, ECF membership would be required to play in any English Congress, no matter where you came from. As it currently stands, for internationally rated events non ENG players make no contribution whatsoever, whether direct or indirect, to the ECF's funds. For an organisation short of money, it's turning its back on a source of funding and one that the Italian Federation and many others take advantage of.

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Adam Raoof
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Adam Raoof » Thu May 10, 2012 8:36 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Stewart Reuben wrote: The prime source for English events is the ECF website.


Personally I would Google directly for the event website.
Good luck with that. Some events don't even have their own website....
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Roger de Coverly
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu May 10, 2012 8:52 am

Adam Raoof wrote: Good luck with that. Some events don't even have their own website....
If they don't have a website, or at the very least somewhere from which to download an entry form , they wouldn't have a link on the ECF website either. If you were generically looking for tournaments in the UK, I don't think you would find the ECF Calendar. For example "Golders Green chess" finds the Golder Green website, this forum and various local references such as the Hendon club, but only finds the ECF site when Golders Green is mentioned in one of the news items.

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Adam Raoof
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Adam Raoof » Thu May 10, 2012 9:00 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Adam Raoof wrote: Good luck with that. Some events don't even have their own website....
If they don't have a website, or at the very least somewhere from which to download an entry form , they wouldn't have a link on the ECF website either. If you were generically looking for tournaments in the UK, I don't think you would find the ECF Calendar. For example "Golders Green chess" finds the Golder Green website, this forum and various local references such as the Hendon club, but only finds the ECF site when Golders Green is mentioned in one of the news items.
I only know about the Berks and Bucks Congress through the ECF Calendar.
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Ian Kingston » Thu May 10, 2012 9:15 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Stewart Reuben wrote: The prime source for English events is the ECF website.


Personally I would Google directly for the event website.
Which might work if you know that an event exists, but it doesn't help if you're simply looking to see what's on in the next month or two. A collated list could of course be provided by a third party, but it would take time to get established and would have no guarantee of quality or continuity.

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Re: ECF Office

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu May 10, 2012 9:30 am

Ian Kingston wrote: A collated list could of course be provided by a third party, but it would take time to get established and would have no guarantee of quality or continuity.
The value or otherwise of a national calendar has little or nothing to do with membership and a website containing it by no means has to be that of the national federation. In the BCF's recent history, when the BCM site under John Saunders was one of the earlier commercial pioneers, that commercial website contained a calendar. So commercial hosting is possible, the host using it to attract visitors.

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Adam Raoof
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Adam Raoof » Thu May 10, 2012 9:42 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Ian Kingston wrote: A collated list could of course be provided by a third party, but it would take time to get established and would have no guarantee of quality or continuity.
The value or otherwise of a national calendar has little or nothing to do with membership and a website containing it by no means has to be that of the national federation. In the BCF's recent history, when the BCM site under John Saunders was one of the earlier commercial pioneers, that commercial website contained a calendar. So commercial hosting is possible, the host using it to attract visitors.
And now it doesn't. The primary purpose of a Federation and an Office is to ensure continuity.

I hope that with our new membership software we will be able to offer tournaments a better service to promote their events - the ability to market them directly to all the members, build a simple event website and to take entries online would be a good development. We already have advertising space on the Grading Database, and it wouldn't be difficult to feature advertisements for specific tournaments each month on a rolling basis.
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu May 10, 2012 10:03 am

Adam Raoof wrote: - the ability to market them directly to all the members
I disagree with your mindset. Why should tournament organisers restrict their marketing to existing members of the ECF? Surely the pool of people who can play chess at a tournament level is much larger, to say nothing of potential tourists not resident in England?

Paul Sanders
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Paul Sanders » Thu May 10, 2012 10:07 am

The French Federation has an amazing online tournament service, including in-tournament pairing and results hosting, all tied into the calendar. Here's an example of a tournament just finished:

http://www.echecs.asso.fr/FicheTournoi.aspx?Ref=23985

with full crosstable:

http://www.echecs.asso.fr/Resultat.aspx ... &Action=Ga

The fact that I can see it proves that it's not limited to members of the FFE. I would say that the FFE website is by far the best way to find tournaments as a chess tourist to France.

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Adam Raoof
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Adam Raoof » Thu May 10, 2012 10:07 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Adam Raoof wrote: - the ability to market them directly to all the members
I disagree with your mindset. Why should tournament organisers restrict their marketing to existing members of the ECF? Surely the pool of people who can play chess at a tournament level is much larger, to say nothing of potential tourists not resident in England?
I agree with you.
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John Upham
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Re: ECF Office

Post by John Upham » Thu May 10, 2012 10:10 am

The ECF calendar is a valued resource especially as it lists events where a web site is not known or does not exist.

For some events we may never see a web site until a new team inherits that event.

I did consider adding a definitive calendar to the new BCM site but the ECF does an excellent job provided organisers remember to use it.

One of the extras I would add would be an ICAL type entry for each event. This would allow users to click on the ICAL icon and add that event to your calendering application automatically.

If you visit http://www.londonchess.org.uk/ and select "Local Events" you should see what I mean.
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Adam Raoof
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Adam Raoof » Thu May 10, 2012 10:14 am

John Upham wrote:If you visit http://www.londonchess.org.uk/ and select "Local Events" you should see what I mean.
*like*
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Roger de Coverly
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Re: ECF Office

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu May 10, 2012 10:31 am

Paul Sanders wrote: The fact that I can see it proves that it's not limited to members of the FFE. I would say that the FFE website is by far the best way to find tournaments as a chess tourist to France.
I think if you are a French resident, you wouldn't be allowed to play unless you were a member of a French club or at the every least purchased a "licence to play chess" from a local club. International events allow foreign players, I would say of course, were it not for the USCF precedent who demand membership for everyone. The position on French rapidplays is less clear. Paul Buswell has reported that Hastings players sometimes cross the Channel for one day events and find a variable policy as to whether they are expected to have a licence.

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Re: ECF Office

Post by Ian Kingston » Thu May 10, 2012 10:50 am

Paul Sanders wrote:The French Federation has an amazing online tournament service, including in-tournament pairing and results hosting, all tied into the calendar. Here's an example of a tournament just finished:

http://www.echecs.asso.fr/FicheTournoi.aspx?Ref=23985

with full crosstable:

http://www.echecs.asso.fr/Resultat.aspx ... &Action=Ga

The fact that I can see it proves that it's not limited to members of the FFE. I would say that the FFE website is by far the best way to find tournaments as a chess tourist to France.
And it has authority because it comes from the FFE. Roger, you're beaten on this point. You can twist and turn to show that logically such a list doesn't have to be run by a national federation, but it turns out that in reality it's better done that way.

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