What constitutes meaningful consultation?
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What constitutes meaningful consultation?
I've just cone across a document on the government websites which advises on the principles of consultation. Although written specifically for use by government departments, it nevertheless provides a useful guide for other organisations.
Link: https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... _final.pdf
In Summary:
a. Consultations should be clear and concise
b. Consultations should have a purpose
c. Consultations should be informative
d. Consultations are only part of a process of engagement
e. Consultations should last for a proportionate amount of time
f. Consultations should be targeted
g. Consultations should take account of the groups being consulted
h. Consultations should be agreed before publication
i. Consultation should facilitate scrutiny
j. Government responses to consultations should be published in a timely fashion
k. Consultation exercises should not generally be launched during local or national election periods
Link: https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... _final.pdf
In Summary:
a. Consultations should be clear and concise
b. Consultations should have a purpose
c. Consultations should be informative
d. Consultations are only part of a process of engagement
e. Consultations should last for a proportionate amount of time
f. Consultations should be targeted
g. Consultations should take account of the groups being consulted
h. Consultations should be agreed before publication
i. Consultation should facilitate scrutiny
j. Government responses to consultations should be published in a timely fashion
k. Consultation exercises should not generally be launched during local or national election periods
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
The idea of consultation is well motivated but what exactly is the purpose the exercise:ECF website[1] wrote:The ECF is inviting responses from arbiters, players, and other interested parties before Monday, 8th August. A form to respond to these consultation papers can be found here[2]. For general feedback in this matter, please use the Ask the Directors button[3] on the left of the website …
a. What particular decisions are to be made and what are the options?
b. Are there any financial implications to be considered?
c. When will results of the consultation be published and what actions will result from it?
1. Invitation to consultation: http://www.englishchess.org.uk/arbiter- ... sultation/
2. Consultation response form: https://britchess.wufoo.eu/forms/arbite ... tion-form/
3. Ask the Directors: http://www.englishchess.org.uk/ask-the-directors/
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
It seems to me that you are trying to straitjacket 'consultation' into a narrowly defined format that does not take account of different reasons for the initial consultation. It strikes me that the questions above do not need answering in advance of the current consultation but had I instituted it my replies would be as follows:Michael Flatt wrote:The idea of consultation is well motivated but what exactly is the purpose the exercise:ECF website[1] wrote:The ECF is inviting responses from arbiters, players, and other interested parties before Monday, 8th August. A form to respond to these consultation papers can be found here[2]. For general feedback in this matter, please use the Ask the Directors button[3] on the left of the website …
a. What particular decisions are to be made and what are the options?
b. Are there any financial implications to be considered?
c. When will results of the consultation be published and what actions will result from it?
(a) That depends on the ideas that come back as a result of the consultation
(b) That depends on the ideas that come back as a result of the consultation.
(c) (Part 1): When I get time: the consultation is to help me bring forward ideas.
(c) (Part 2): That depends on the ideas that come back as a result of the consultation.
People seeking feedback on their ideas should not be expected to jump through a series of administrative hoops. The only effect of requiring that is that they'll probably decide not to bother at all.
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
My way of thinking is that anyone seeking feedback on a policy or its implementation would more likely to get a response if there is some clarity in the question being posed. If you cannot formulate a meaningful question it is doubtful whether you will get a meaningful response.Michael Farthing wrote:It seems to me that you are trying to straitjacket 'consultation' into a narrowly defined format that does not take account of different reasons for the initial consultation. ...
People seeking feedback on their ideas should not be expected to jump through a series of administrative hoops. The only effect of requiring that is that they'll probably decide not to bother at all.
In fact, the question turns out to be about Competition Rules and Grading rather than what I had initially understood to have been about the classification of ECF Arbiters.
I interpret the central question to be something like: Do you agree that all competitions seeking to be graded by the ECF should be overseen by an ECF Arbiter registered at Level 2 or higher?
How details like mileage rate get included in the mix is difficult to understand.
Last edited by Michael Flatt on Sat Jun 11, 2016 10:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
There is the proposal to amalgamate the ECF hierarchy of arbiters with the parallel FIDE hierarchy. A relevant point there is whether the CAA are in favour or spitting blood over the proposal.Michael Flatt wrote: In fact, the question turns out to be about Competition Rules and Grading rather than what I had initially understood to have been about the classification of ECF Arbiters.
Putting obstacles in the way of getting games graded is a risky path. Perhaps an event will still take place if it cannot be graded, perhaps it won't.
The more use is made of computerised pairings and incremental move rates, the less need there is for specialist skills to enable events to be run. Demanding the presence of arbiters, "just in case" is restrictive practice job creation.
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
The Chess Arbiters' Association have published a News item on their website regarding the Home Director's proposal and invitation for comment. Link to CAA News http://chessarbitersassociation.co.uk/html/news.htmlRoger de Coverly wrote:There is the proposal to amalgamate the ECF hierarchy of arbiters with the parallel FIDE hierarchy. A relevant point there is whether the CAA are in favour or spitting blood over the proposal.
Given that the CAA appears to include the ECF Chief Arbiter, ECF Manager of Arbiters(home), ECF Manager of Arbiters(International) and the Organiser of the British Championships among its number it is virtually indistinguishable from what one might consider to be the ECF Arbiter committee; apart from the fact, of course, that it does not report to the ECF Board nor are its activities subject to the scrutiny of the ECF Governance committee.
The CAA does seem to be a force for good in that it is the driving force behind the various ECF and FIDE Arbiter training seminars that have appeared over the last year or two. Had the CAA not existed it is doubtful whether such training courses would ever have taken place.
In the CAA's AGM draft minutes (Warwick, 2015) those members present expressed concern regarding the organisation's continuing viability as it had no formal standing with FIDE. Link: http://chessarbitersassociation.co.uk/html/minutes.html
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
Not true on either count, I'm afraid.The CAA does seem to be a force for good in that it is the driving force behind the various ECF and FIDE Arbiter training seminars that have appeared over the last year or two. Had the CAA not existed it is doubtful whether such training courses would ever have taken place.
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
I'm aware of two FIDE Arbiters Seminars in England taking place in the last 12 months. One was in Preston, and the instigator was David Clayton. The other was in Birmingham, and the instigator was me. In both cases, the lecturers were Alex McFarlane and Lara Barnes. In neither case was the CAA involved.Mike Truran wrote:Not true on either count, I'm afraid.The CAA does seem to be a force for good in that it is the driving force behind the various ECF and FIDE Arbiter training seminars that have appeared over the last year or two. Had the CAA not existed it is doubtful whether such training courses would ever have taken place.
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
On the other hand, a few years ago, if you wanted to do the ECF Arbiter's course and exam the course fee had a year's membership of the CAA inlcuded in it. Maybe that's no longer the case.Alex Holowczak wrote:I'm aware of two FIDE Arbiters Seminars in England taking place in the last 12 months. One was in Preston, and the instigator was David Clayton. The other was in Birmingham, and the instigator was me. In both cases, the lecturers were Alex McFarlane and Lara Barnes. In neither case was the CAA involved.Mike Truran wrote:Not true on either count, I'm afraid.The CAA does seem to be a force for good in that it is the driving force behind the various ECF and FIDE Arbiter training seminars that have appeared over the last year or two. Had the CAA not existed it is doubtful whether such training courses would ever have taken place.
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
I get the impression from reading the CAA's minutes that one of their primary functions had been to advise on Arbiter training courses and to support anyone wanting to organise them. It seems that the Treasurer queried the subsidies paid by the CAA from members' subscriptions and it has resulted in the subsidy being withdrawn.Mike Truran wrote:Not true on either count, I'm afraid.The CAA does seem to be a force for good in that it is the driving force behind the various ECF and FIDE Arbiter training seminars that have appeared over the last year or two. Had the CAA not existed it is doubtful whether such training courses would ever have taken place.
Many of the activities reported in the CAA minutes are things that one might expect to occur in an ECF Arbiter committee had one existed.
The existence of the CAA is under threat and I note that they are disappointed at the lack of recognition they get from the ECF board regarding the valuable work they have done over many years.
CAA AGM [1] wrote:ECF to take responsibility for training of arbiters and expenses incurred by coaches. The meeting felt that this was not an expense that should be met from CAA membership fees.
[1] AGM Minutes, Warwick 2015: http://chessarbitersassociation.co.uk/D ... M_2015.rtfCAA Treasurer's Report [2] wrote: A payment of £200 was made to cover the costs of one Arbiter's Course in 2014.
...
Requests have been made recently to the committee for covering costs for another Arbiter's course, but those asking are not current members.
Should Arbiters be current members of the Association if they are requesting support from us?
[2] CAA Treasurer's Report, Warwick 2015: http://chessarbitersassociation.co.uk/h ... ports.html
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
Correct, that's no longer the case. Even then, those were only courses being organised by the CAA.Ian Thompson wrote:On the other hand, a few years ago, if you wanted to do the ECF Arbiter's course and exam the course fee had a year's membership of the CAA inlcuded in it. Maybe that's no longer the case.
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
To correct a few errors.
The CAA welcomes membership from anyone. You do not have to be invited.
The draft minutes of the AGM might come across a bit more strongly than the meeting itself did. Certainly there was discussion on the future and the relationship with the ECF. I see that as something that will be progressed.
The Preston FIDE Arbiter's Seminar was organised by Dave Clayton and the CAA. I was there as observer (and my material was used) but the lecturers were David Welch and Lara Barnes.
Birmingham was organised by the 4NCL/ECF. Lara and I were the lecturers.
The CAA welcomes membership from anyone. You do not have to be invited.
The draft minutes of the AGM might come across a bit more strongly than the meeting itself did. Certainly there was discussion on the future and the relationship with the ECF. I see that as something that will be progressed.
The Preston FIDE Arbiter's Seminar was organised by Dave Clayton and the CAA. I was there as observer (and my material was used) but the lecturers were David Welch and Lara Barnes.
Birmingham was organised by the 4NCL/ECF. Lara and I were the lecturers.
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
Fair enough. I thought you and Lara were lecturers; and David was the observer.Alex McFarlane wrote:The Preston FIDE Arbiter's Seminar was organised by Dave Clayton and the CAA. I was there as observer (and my material was used) but the lecturers were David Welch and Lara Barnes.
Birmingham was organised by the 4NCL/ECF. Lara and I were the lecturers.
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
A word of caution on dealings with FIDE whose governance standards are not those of HMG.
I believe that in the international context sitting in the same room can sometimes be enough under international law .
Official Foreign Office advice some years ago , in the interval between the two Gulf Wars, on cross border water flows into Iraq from a dam project in Turkey, is the origin of my belief.
I believe that in the international context sitting in the same room can sometimes be enough under international law .
Official Foreign Office advice some years ago , in the interval between the two Gulf Wars, on cross border water flows into Iraq from a dam project in Turkey, is the origin of my belief.
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Re: What constitutes meaningful consultation?
I know what constitutes a really boring post..... ^
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.