Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
NickFaulks
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Jan 18, 2017 5:56 pm

Michael Flatt wrote: Neither congress is able to register their Open as FIDE rated as they have to schedule three games on Saturday, through not being to able to book the venue on Friday evening.
I don't understand why St Albans could not be FIDE rated. Three games in a day is permissible.
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Roger de Coverly
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Roger de Coverly » Wed Jan 18, 2017 6:15 pm

NickFaulks wrote: I don't understand why St Albans could not be FIDE rated. Three games in a day is permissible.

They use sessions of three and a half hours.Saturday round times are 10:00, 14:30 and 18:30, so the round finishes by 10 pm. They also use a traditional 36 moves in 90 minutes followed by 15 minutes to finish.

By contrast Kidlington goes for an earlier start with round times at 9:30, 14:00 and 18:30. The Kidlington move rate is 90 minutes with 15 second increments, so there's the possibility of a later finish or over-running earlier rounds.

NickFaulks
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Jan 18, 2017 6:23 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote: They use sessions of three and a half hours.
So we're back to the problem of the venue having to be cleared by 10pm ( or soon after ). In the old days that wasn't a worry, but times have changed.
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Michael Flatt
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Michael Flatt » Wed Jan 18, 2017 6:31 pm

NickFaulks wrote: I don't understand why St Albans could not be FIDE rated. Three games in a day is permissible.
FIDE rating regulations[1] specify:
1. Rate of Play
Where at least one of the players in the tournament has a rating 2200 or higher, each player must have a minimum of 120 minutes.

In practice, this would limit St Albans to 2 rounds per day.

[1] FIDE Rating Regulation: https://www.fide.com/component/handbook ... cle&id=172
Last edited by Michael Flatt on Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Roger de Coverly » Wed Jan 18, 2017 6:47 pm

NickFaulks wrote: So we're back to the problem of the venue having to be cleared by 10pm ( or soon after ). In the old days that wasn't a worry, but times have changed.
I doubt it's the venue being the problem. More likely the players, arbiters and organisers wanting to get home or to the pub at a more reasonable hour.

Jonathan Bryant
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Jonathan Bryant » Wed Jan 18, 2017 7:27 pm

NickFaulks wrote: I don't understand why St Albans could not be FIDE rated.
It’s been a while since I played there - 2011 I think it was - but I thought it *was* elo rated back then. Perfectly possible I’m misremembering, though.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Roger de Coverly » Wed Jan 18, 2017 8:46 pm

Jonathan Bryant wrote: - but I thought it *was* elo rated back then.
I don't believe it (St Albans) has ever been Elo rated. In the Open, the whole field would most likely have ratings, but that's not quite the same thing.

Michael Flatt
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Michael Flatt » Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:48 am

The last complete list of qualifiers (2016) is given at: http://www.britishchesschampionships.co ... iers-2016/

It might be an interesting exercise to determine how many players would have qualified under the proposed 2018 qualification regulations.

Would the so called "weak tail" actually disappear?

Paul Cooksey
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Paul Cooksey » Thu Jan 19, 2017 8:07 am

I see from that list I would have taken the qualifying place of someone rated 1995. We can assume I would not have played at the British, since I did not, and it is not the weak tail that puts me off.

I'm not sure whether that is a good or a bad thing, since the paper does not adequately explain what the organisers are trying to achieve.

Mick Norris
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Mick Norris » Thu Jan 19, 2017 8:35 am

Michael Flatt wrote:The last complete list of qualifiers (2016) is given at: http://www.britishchesschampionships.co ... iers-2016/

It might be an interesting exercise to determine how many players would have qualified under the proposed 2018 qualification regulations.

Would the so called "weak tail" actually disappear?
2017 qualifiers

If anyone defers qualification to 2018, then there would still be an issue then, so maybe 2019 would be the real test of any new system
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Roger de Coverly
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu Jan 19, 2017 9:54 am

Mick Norris wrote: If anyone defers qualification to 2018, then there would still be an issue then, so maybe 2019 would be the real test of any new system
In terms of numbers of lower rated players participating, the key point is perhaps not so much abolishing the rights of tournaments such as St Albans, Hertford, Scarborough, Kidlington, Blackpool etc to qualifying places, but to sweep away the qualification based on domestic grade.

For example for 2017, it's a long list.
Graded >=218
Abbas, Daniel; Amru, Tariq; Bane, John; Boukobza, Adrien; Brown, Martin; Brunello, Roberta; Buckley, David E; Burnett, Andrew; Chow, Sam; Crickmore, Neil EG; Dorrington, Chris J; Galliano, Alexander; Gough, Michael J; Hopwood, Paul M; Kiss, Gergely; Law, Zhe Kang; Lee, Bryan G; Littlewood, Paul E; MacDonald, David R; Macklin, Paul; Marsh, Sean; Mayhew, Andrew; Meier, Terrence; Nicholas, Koichi B; O`Toole, George E; Tiruchirapalli, Venkataramanan; Tukpetov, Evgeny; Valles Mata, David; Weaving, Richard; Webb, Matthew D

Juniors Graded >=180
Asenov, Pavel; Asher, Emery; Ashworth, Michael J; Balaji, Ananthanarayanan; Brewer, Callum D; Broadley, Henry; Brozel, Sacha; Bunyan, James KR; Coombs, Charles; Dalton, Joseph; Dixit, Kumar; Donaldson, Thomas R; Eggink, Matheusz; Fitzgerald, Robert C; Foo, William J; Fortune, George T; Frobert, Theo; Gallagher, Daniel GH; Goldie, Thomas; Golding, Alex; Grieve, Harry; Gupta, Arul; Hackner, Oskar A; Hand, Freddie; Haridas, Girinath; Herring, Sam AC; Higgins, Michael; Jayawarna, Nugith; Jina, Taran; Kalavannan, Koby; Kalid, Raphael; Klingher, Dominic; Lee, Kai Jie Edward; Lentzos, Ioannis; Levene, Joseph; Li, Harry; Liang, Jake Z; Malhotra, Tarun; Mitra, Roman C; Moreby, James E; Moss, Guy; Murphy, Conor E; Ng, Andrew; Oyama, Akito; Pein, Jonathan; Petr, Jan; Poyner, Alex; Price, Gwilym T; Redman, David J; Slade, Theo; Taylor, Adam A; Taylor, Oliver; Thomas, Ben; Twigge-Molecey, Billy; Whatley, Stephen AJ Jr; Williams, Peter A Jr; Willow, Jonah B; Willson, Ollie; Yesudian, Rohan; Zhang, Anthony Y; Zhang, Roy Y; Zhu, Richard

Women Graded >=180
Giles, Yasmin; Head, Louise; Hoare, Amy B; Kueh, Audrey; Manelidou, Maria; Norinkeviciute, Rasa; Sucikova, Svetlana
Although with the Under 21, Under 18 titles and Women's titles determined in the British, it makes for difficulties if potential competitors are excluded because they aren't able to play lots of tournaments to qualify by a Grand Prix route.

The extension of the number of grade or rating qualifiers is a relatively recent development, within the term of office of the Home Director or his immediate predecessor. Previously the cut off was a 2350/2360 rating or domestic equivalent. Several regular FM competitors in the Major Open, or British when they qualified through a tournament now had guaranteed places.

Andrew Zigmond
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Thu Jan 19, 2017 10:53 am

I'm probably being thick here but one of the players listed in the graded >=218 (a very good friend of mine) has been inactive for two years and the highest his grade ever got was 188 (in 2011), so I don't quite understand how he came to appear on the list. It does show a need for reform; I think he'd be quite flattered to find out he can play in the British.
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E Michael White
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by E Michael White » Thu Jan 19, 2017 11:15 am

Paul Cooksey wrote:.....the paper does not adequately explain what the organisers are trying to achieve.
right!

The timing of the changes IMO is ill-advised. In the Brexit period players and families are likely to review their holiday strategies. An appearance at the BCC may be squeezed out and a tournament abroad substituted, doubling as an overseas holiday. But no one really knows the likely effect of the changes.

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:02 pm

The last bit of the proposal caught my eye:

"The host Federation, or if the Championships are played in England the host county, will have the right to nominate two wildcards."

Why two wildcards here, rather than one? Is this new or carried over from the old system?

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:41 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote: Why two wildcards here, rather than one? Is this new or carried over from the old system?
It's a slightly reworded version of the 2017 Regulations.
(h) 2 nominees for the County in which the Championships are being held; or if the Championships are held outside England, two additional nominees for the Organisation in 14(a)-(g) hosting the Championships.
I think the new wording is marginally inexact, since two of the BICC signatories, namely Ulster and the Isle of Man are not Federations in the FIDE sense.

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