Why is this position evaluated so?

Technical questions regarding Openings, Middlegames, Endings etc.
soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby soheil_hooshdaran » Wed Jun 22, 2016 1:56 am

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
Christopher Kreuzer wrote:1...Bb7 2.Qxd6 Na5 3.Bxf7+ Kxf7 4.e5 presumably fails to something, or peters out to equality.


I was wondering if anyone would follow up on this. Would the time spent analysing this position (followed by use of a computer engine) be useful or not? i.e. Is this a good training position? Is it another position from a Grivas book (mentioned earlier in the thread)?


Yes, from a book of GM Grivas

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby soheil_hooshdaran » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:06 am

[FEN "4rrk1/1bq2ppp/p1n5/1p5Q/8/P7/BP1B1PPP/R3R1K1 b - - 0 19"] [SetUp "1"] *
With a big advantage due to the bishop pair and superior piece coordination" [for White]
Why is the coordination superior? What coordination?
Last edited by soheil_hooshdaran on Fri Jun 24, 2016 9:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby soheil_hooshdaran » Fri Jun 24, 2016 9:35 am

[FEN "4r1k1/1q3pp1/7p/p7/1p1P4/P1n2P2/3R2PP/Q3B2K w - - 0 30"] [SetUp "1"] *
What isthe basis of Black's initiative in the above position?

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby soheil_hooshdaran » Fri Jun 24, 2016 9:40 am

[FEN "4r1k1/1b3pp1/pq2nn1p/1p6/2p5/P1N1PB2/1PQ2PPP/2R1B1K1 w - - 0 22"] [SetUp "1"] *
Why is Black's piece coordination said to be superior?

MartinCarpenter
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby MartinCarpenter » Fri Jun 24, 2016 9:43 am

You know what coordination means, yes? Its obvious in the position above. Rather less so in the bishop pair one.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby Roger de Coverly » Fri Jun 24, 2016 9:49 am

soheil_hooshdaran wrote: [FEN "4r1k1/1q3pp1/7p/p7/1p1P4/P1n2P2/3R2PP/Q3B2K w - - 0 30"] [SetUp "1"] *
What is the basis of Black's initiative in the above position?


Monster Knight on c3
Passed b pawn
Ineffective Bishop on e1

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby soheil_hooshdaran » Fri Jun 24, 2016 12:39 pm

MartinCarpenter wrote:You know what coordination means, yes? Its obvious in the position above. Rather less so in the bishop pair one.

What are the pieces coordinated for?

MartinCarpenter
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby MartinCarpenter » Fri Jun 24, 2016 12:51 pm

It generally means that they're coordinated with each other. So they can defend each other, attack as a fairly unified group etc.

In the position in question the immediate issue is white's knight on c3 - its bang in the way of the e1 bishop and the rook/queen on c1 and c2. Even if you move it somewhere though, then the bishop strongly 'wants' to come to c3 and what are the rook and queen doing on c1 and c2?
(Also, less seriously, the f3 bishop is rather cut off from its friends.).

Its very hard to make coherent sense out of it all.

In contrast all black needs to do is to move his e6 knight towards d3 (yikes!), or just shunt the e8 rook rover to d8 and everything is doing something useful.

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby soheil_hooshdaran » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:10 pm

[FEN "3r4/pp1r1pk1/5n1p/3p2pP/6P1/P1NRPP2/1P3K2/3R4 b - - 0 28"] [SetUp "1"] *
Why does the author say that the e6-pawn is weak?

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby soheil_hooshdaran » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:23 pm

Here, the author says ......g5 would weaken Black's position, why?
[FEN "3r4/pp1r1pk1/5npp/3p4/5NPP/P2RPP2/1P3K2/3R4 b - - 0 25"] [SetUp "1"] *
Is it a general fact the advancing pawns weakens them in an endgame?

MartinCarpenter
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby MartinCarpenter » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:28 pm

Sometimes :) g5 not so weak by itself here, but imagine white going hg, Ne2, Nd4, Nf5......

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby soheil_hooshdaran » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:35 pm

MartinCarpenter wrote:Sometimes :) g5 not so weak by itself here, but imagine white going hg, Ne2, Nd4, Nf5......

Oh, yes. f5 would be an outpost then

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby soheil_hooshdaran » Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:14 am

What happens after
13...Nc6 14.Nd5 in:
[FEN "rn3rk1/1bqnbppp/pp1pp3/8/Q1PNP3/2N1BP2/PP2B1PP/2RR2K1 b - - 0 13"] [SetUp "1"] * ?? :o

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby soheil_hooshdaran » Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:32 am

What'd be the basis for White's (slight) advantage in:
[FEN "1qrr2k1/1bb2ppp/p3pn2/2R5/3NP3/1Q3P2/P5PP/3R1BBK b - - 0 23"] [SetUp "1"] *

MartinCarpenter
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Re: Why is this position evaluated so?

Postby MartinCarpenter » Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:37 am

Bad things for black in that initial position, I suspect. Shipov's mammoth hedgehog books are very clear about how strong that sacrifice can be, and that's when it loses a piece!

Not really an evaluation question though, you'd have to work out the concrete consequences. Computers are quite handy for this of course :)

That later position, well, black position is just a bit pointless. The e4 point has survived, and black is out of shots to fire at it. Nice illustration of why black has to break it down earlier actually, or at least get h5,h4,h3/g5,g4 in to soften the long diagonal. Not sure how slight the advantage is in practice for humans, not so nice to play black there.


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