Candidates Matches 3rd - 27th May 2011

[AustinElliott]

If Gelfand can achieve this success in his forties, is there still hope for Short and Adams?

As Loz says, you'd have to think that a lot of it comes down to motivation, and how much drive they still have to push for it.

There is an interesting interview with Gelfand where he talks about this.

[The question was who was a stronger player: the Gelfand of 1992-93 or the Gelfand of today]

"It’s hard to say: then I was bolder, and now I’ve got more experience – but which is more important?!...

Our generation, which reached the top in chess in the early 90s – Ivanchuk, Anand, Kramnik, Topalov, Shirov… – still remains at the top today.

I already mentioned the first time I lost a Candidates Match to Short, in 1991… [Gelfand described it as the most painful defeat of his career] At that time, by the way, among the match losers were Ivanchuk, Anand, myself and Korchnoi… I remember as if it were today the closing ceremony at which Korchnoi sat between me and Ivanchuk. And he said: “guys, don’t get upset, you’ve got every chance of becoming World Champion. I reached my peak playing in Baguio, aged 47… Then I played another match for the World Championship when I was 50. In this hall here there are lots of guys who shout that they’re going to be World Champion, or promise they will be. They haven’t got a hope, while you’ve got every chance. So work on it and everything will be ok”. I remembered Viktor’s words and continue to work, not thinking about results, but about the process of improvement itself."

[Keith Arkell]

With all the hyperbole about chess being a young players game, and the drivel you read suggesting that it's all downhill from about the age of 27 onwards, I'm delighted to see it proved once again that reality is somewhat different.

The fact that both Champion and Challenger are aged forty-something demonstrates that there is more to chess than giving a kid a computer and hoping he'll master everything about the game in a few short years.

Boris Gelfand has an extremely deep and rich undertanding of chess, and this is partly the result of decades of accumulated knowledge and understanding. I think that if a player keeps up his motivation, and remains in good health, then he can continue to improve.

From my own relatively humble level of chess activity I remember being amused by something I read way back in 1993: Mark Hebden and myself had jointly lead the British with a round to go, before both blowing it in the last round. After the Championship Bernard Cafferty wrote somewhere that, with so much young talent coming through, this was likely to have been the last opportunity ''veterans Arkell and Hebden'' had to win the title.
At the time we were aged just 32 and 35!

Gelfand has played some fantastically high quality games in the last few years, and I'm thoroughly looking forward to the match next year.

[Jonathan Rogers]

Wasn't Hebden half a point behind - you, Hennigan and Kumaran were the joint leaders?

But yes, Gelfand is proving a point about age. As you say, it is mostly about motivation and health; and marriage (plus for many, divorce!), children, jobs and mortgages, elderly parents, everything in fact, tends to conspire against most forty year old players persisting with the same motivation. But it doesn't have to be that way for everyone.

(To earlier posters) Motivation is certainly what separates Adams from Gelfand. I don't think there's any point talking about whether Adams will get very far, if he even gets to play in the World Cup at all. He voluntarily withdrew last time, what does that tell you about his motivation?

[Matthew Peat]

"It will depend on if Luke can get time off work."

I don't know if McShane's return to professional chess was ever more than an extended sabbatical but it is a shame to hear. It was only a matter of time before he reached 2700+ and with Short's return to form there was a prospect of 3 2700 players playing for England in the 2012 Olympiad. I noted that McShane didn't accept his invitation to British Champs and I hear he has not (yet) accepted the invitation for London Chess Classic. I hope he intends to take his place in Corus A in 2012.

[Martin Benjamin]

Gelfand is proving a point about age. As you say, it is mostly about motivation and health; and marriage (plus for many, divorce!), children, jobs and mortgages, elderly parents, everything in fact, tends to conspire against most forty year old players persisting with the same motivation.

Quite true. I would not have it any other way, but in my late forties, all of the above and some other matters not mentioned take priority over chess. It is not just a question of being unable to concentrate fully on the game because of the distraction of thinking about the other matters; concentration, determination and focus suffer also because I know the other things are far more important, so it becomes harder to be too serious minded about the result of the game.

(I don't know how true this all is, but it's comforting to have a good excuse for playing poorly!)

[Phil Neatherway]

I was wondering what Luke's work is?

[LozCooper]

Wasn't Hebden half a point behind - you, Hennigan and Kumaran were the joint leaders?

But yes, Gelfand is proving a point about age. As you say, it is mostly about motivation and health; and marriage (plus for many, divorce!), children, jobs and mortgages, elderly parents, everything in fact, tends to conspire against most forty year old players persisting with the same motivation. But it doesn't have to be that way for everyone.

(To earlier posters) Motivation is certainly what separates Adams from Gelfand. I don't think there's any point talking about whether Adams will get very far, if he even gets to play in the World Cup at all. He voluntarily withdrew last time, what does that tell you about his motivation?

Well Adams withdrew for the same reasons that Carlsen did after they changed the regulations and dates several times. Rather than a lack of motivation you could also interpret it as not basing your whole chess life around the world championship when there are plenty of other top level tournaments to play in. I daresay a lot of other players felt the same but their financial positions may mean that they feel obliged to put up with the uncertainty of FIDE's organising skills and commit regardless.

[Mark Howitt]

It's nice to see now a more well known figure has made the point about Adams not having nearly as much motivation as Gelfand, for example, that he doesn't get shouted down .

Fact is in chess, (or in similar sports like poker, more or less any 'mind actvitiy'), you CAN still play at the top level at a later age, you just have to keep working with as much energy, focus and 'joy' as those who are younger. Even if you can't quite match their energy levels, (older players probably can't, at least in terms of physical ability, but this doesn't play a massive part in chess), your experience and 'know how' can give you an advantage. Gelfand has said he "trains every day, there is no other way". And it seems he puts a lot of effort in at the board. I would guess his Jewish upbringing, coupled with his personal ethos, insists that he MUST work hard to be good at something, and that he does.

[Mark Howitt]

The last I heard Luke had come back to proffessional chess, but obviously he likes a job to get some more money too!

[LozCooper]

The last I heard Luke had come back to proffessional chess, but obviously he likes a job to get some more money too!

He gave up his job in early/mid 2009 and then started work again in April 2011.

[Matthew Peat]

The last I heard Luke had come back to proffessional chess, but obviously he likes a job to get some more money too!

He gave up his job in early/mid 2009 and then started work again in April 2011.

I guess that makes it unlikely that Luke will take up his World Cup place, pushing Adams up the queue.

[Leonard Barden]

[quote="Jonathan RogersI don't think there's any point talking about whether Adams will get very far, if he even gets to play in the World Cup at all. He voluntarily withdrew last time, what does that tell you about his motivation?[/quote]

Adams withdrew from the last World Cup because it clashed with the London Classic and was scheduled for Siberia in December.

Historically, the World Cup has been by far his best career event: narrowly losing the final after many games to Anand at Groningen, beating Kramnik and reaching the semi-final against Akopian in Las Vegas, and losing the final after missing a one-move crusher against Kasimdzhanov in Tripoli.

That gives him a very powerful motivation.

[LozCooper]

The last I heard Luke had come back to proffessional chess, but obviously he likes a job to get some more money too!

He gave up his job in early/mid 2009 and then started work again in April 2011.

I guess that makes it unlikely that Luke will take up his World Cup place, pushing Adams up the queue.

I think if Luke doesn't play then the next eligible player from the World Cup will take his place so it has no affect on Mickey as far as I know.

[Mick Norris]

I guess that makes it unlikely that Luke will take up his World Cup place, pushing Adams up the queue.

It doesn't push Mickey up the queue

FIDE regulations for World Cup 2011 state

"Continental and Zonal qualifiers will be replaced from their respective events, except that in the Zonal Tournament, the replacement must have scored 50% or more in the Zonal event. Otherwise the place passes to the Continental Championship. The average rating list has priority if a player qualifies either from the rating list or a zonal/continental event."

[Jonathan Rogers]

[quote="Jonathan RogersI don't think there's any point talking about whether Adams will get very far, if he even gets to play in the World Cup at all. He voluntarily withdrew last time, what does that tell you about his motivation?

Adams withdrew from the last World Cup because it clashed with the London Classic and was scheduled for Siberia in December.

Historically, the World Cup has been by far his best career event: narrowly losing the final after many games to Anand at Groningen, beating Kramnik and reaching the semi-final against Akopian in Las Vegas, and losing the final after missing a one-move crusher against Kasimdzhanov in Tripoli.

That gives him a very powerful motivation.[/quote]

Well! It should give him a powerful motivation - but does it? Adams still chose not to play the World Cup in Siberia. Gelfand did, and I still remember those hilarious photohraphs of him wearing that woolly headgear because of the freezing conditions. Need I (or Mark) say anymore about Gelfand obviously "wanting it" more than Adams?