London Chess Classic Super Rapidplay

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Ian Thompson
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Re: London Chess Classic Super Rapidplay

Post by Ian Thompson » Tue Dec 09, 2014 10:23 pm

Ian Thompson wrote:You must have a different entry form from me. I thought it was a very poor prize list for those rated over 2000, but less than about 2500 (i.e. those ineligible for grading prizes, but very unlikely to win a place prize).
JustinHadi wrote:Glad to be of service, it seems all the grading prizes on the entry form have been paid out :) I believe ECF rapid ratings were converted where available, otherwise FIDE rapid ratings used. Possibly because of higher than expected entries, the prizes have been improved.
You do have a different entry form to me. This
LCC_2014_Entry_Form.pdf
(134.39 KiB) Downloaded 70 times
is the one that I downloaded from the website on 15 October, printed copies of which were available at the event last Saturday. The website also has the same prize fund listed on this page.

If the organisers did create new grading prizes for those in the 2001 - 2300 rating range that's obviously good; what's not good is not publicising this at the event. Altrhough the place prizes for 6th- 8th place are missing from your entry form presumably they must have been paid out because they are stated to be guaranteed on my entry form.

Ian Thompson
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Location: Awbridge, Hampshire

Re: London Chess Classic Super Rapidplay

Post by Ian Thompson » Tue Dec 16, 2014 11:57 pm

Ian Thompson wrote:You do have a different entry form to me. This
LCC_2014_Entry_Form.pdf
is the one that I downloaded from the website on 15 October, printed copies of which were available at the event last Saturday. The website also has the same prize fund listed on this page.

If the organisers did create new grading prizes for those in the 2001 - 2300 rating range that's obviously good; what's not good is not publicising this at the event. Although the place prizes for 6th- 8th place are missing from your entry form presumably they must have been paid out because they are stated to be guaranteed on my entry form.
Evidently not, according to the published list of prize winners. The 10 players tied for 3rd place are shown as winning £900 each when they should have got £1050 each, as the total of 3rd - 8th prizes is £10,500.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: London Chess Classic Super Rapidplay

Post by Roger de Coverly » Wed Dec 17, 2014 12:10 am

Ian Thompson wrote: Evidently not, according to the published list of prize winners. The 10 players tied for 3rd place are shown as winning £900 each when they should have got £1050 each, as the total of 3rd - 8th prizes is £10,500.
There do seem to have been several different versions of the prize fund in various documents. If the event is run again in the 2013 format, a coherent set of announcements as to initial and enhanced prize funds would seem necessary. It's a guess, but were the W-We prizes something of a hybrid, in that a converted ECF grade was used as the rating for the calculation?

In a massive ten round event, why is it wrong that points scored should be the tie break for grading or rating prizes? You could use W-We as a tie-break to rank prizes for players on the same score. From a practical viewpoint, you never know whether you are in the running with these (W-We) awards.

Ian Thompson
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Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2008 4:31 pm
Location: Awbridge, Hampshire

Re: London Chess Classic Super Rapidplay

Post by Ian Thompson » Wed Dec 17, 2014 12:47 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Ian Thompson wrote: Evidently not, according to the published list of prize winners. The 10 players tied for 3rd place are shown as winning £900 each when they should have got £1050 each, as the total of 3rd - 8th prizes is £10,500.
There do seem to have been several different versions of the prize fund in various documents. If the event is run again in the 2013 format, a coherent set of announcements as to initial and enhanced prize funds would seem necessary.
In this case it's not an enhancement, it's removal of guaranteed prizes. There are also other significant differences between the entry form I have and the one Justin Hadi posted. Of personal interest (for the second weekend events) is that my entry form does not prohibit players from winning more than one prize, whereas Justin Hadi's version does.
Roger de Coverly wrote:It's a guess, but were the W-We prizes something of a hybrid, in that a converted ECF grade was used as the rating for the calculation?
Who knows, but it's not relevant. There's nothing in either version of the entry form stating that grading prizes would be awarded in this way, so the correct winners of the prizes are the players who scored most points. Justin Hadi's version of the entry form says that in the event of a tie for a rating or grading prize it will go to the lowest rated player. That's what you might expect to see for a grading prize determined by points scored, but doesn't seem at all appropriate if you are using W-We.
Roger de Coverly wrote:In a massive ten round event, why is it wrong that points scored should be the tie break for grading or rating prizes?
It's not wrong. Using W-We is an obviously unfair way of determining winners. It can clearly result in someone scoring 100% but still not having the best W-We. Perhaps more likely, it can result in two players playing the same set of opponents, bar one, and getting exactly the same results, so the winner is whoever happened to play the higher rated of the two who were different, even though the difference in rating between the two might be negligible.
Roger de Coverly wrote:From a practical viewpoint, you never know whether you are in the running with these (W-We) awards.
That's another good reason why W-We is a poor way of determining prize winners.

JustinHadi

Re: London Chess Classic Super Rapidplay

Post by JustinHadi » Wed Dec 17, 2014 12:56 pm

W-We for rating prizes seems to be the second iteration of "It's the taking parts that counts", the first iteration being the rating bands.

Mick Norris
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Re: London Chess Classic Super Rapidplay

Post by Mick Norris » Sun Dec 28, 2014 2:32 pm

Chris Rice wrote:
Ian Thompson wrote:
Chris Rice wrote:Strangely enough there never seems to be much British interest in this competition.
http://ecc.wroclaw.pl/?page_id=41
Perhaps not so strange if you look at flight prices to Poland at this time of year.
I suspect that's probably not the only thing putting the Brits off.

I checked an Easyjet flight from Gatwick to Kracow leaving on 17/12 and coming back 23/12 costing £194.98. From Kracow its a hop and a skip to Wroclaw of 144 miles. Average temperature in Poland at this time of year is -2C but has been as low as -22C. Time of year doesn't really help either ie just before Christmas. Though if you do go and don't care about the cold it looks an amazingly pretty city steeped in loads of history. Of course for a lot of the rest of Europe, particularly Eastern Europe Poland is perfectly situated for cheap as chips travel and accomodation hence the high numbers.

I did wonder after Lawrence's comments whether it might be possible for England to mount a bid to stage the European rapid and blitz though staging it in London or Birmingham might be too expensive. Given that Wroclaw is Poland's fourth largest city I guess the equivalent would be something like Leeds/Sheffield/Manchester/Newcastle/Liverpool?
It is being held in Minsk,Belarus next year
Any postings on here represent my personal views

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