Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:20 pm

Heh. I was teasing slightly there. Depends if you count them as separate events or a single event. It is a single event, but in two different formats of chess, so there are arguments both ways. For the GCT points and prize money, it is a single event.

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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by David Sedgwick » Sat Jun 24, 2017 1:33 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:Heh. I was teasing slightly there. Depends if you count them as separate events or a single event. It is a single event, but in two different formats of chess, so there are arguments both ways. For the GCT points and prize money, it is a single event.
There was a minor problem relating to this last year in Leuven. The organisers had obtained two trophies, not realising that we really needed either one or three.

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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by LawrenceCooper » Sat Jun 24, 2017 3:18 pm

Magnus just lost on time with knight and pawn vs bishop so his lead is reduced to two points.

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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by NickFaulks » Sat Jun 24, 2017 4:15 pm

LawrenceCooper wrote:Magnus just lost on time with knight and pawn vs bishop so his lead is reduced to two points.
I know they're human, but I still don't think a professional player should lose on time in an unloseable position with delay.
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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by LawrenceCooper » Sat Jun 24, 2017 4:24 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
LawrenceCooper wrote:Magnus just lost on time with knight and pawn vs bishop so his lead is reduced to two points.
I know they're human, but I still don't think a professional player should lose on time in an unloseable position with delay.
He did momentarily seem to lose hold of his king which I think caused the lapse. What I found more surprising was that an experienced commentator didn't know the rules when a player runs out of time but thankfully Jovanka was on hand to explain :)

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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by NickFaulks » Sat Jun 24, 2017 4:35 pm

LawrenceCooper wrote:He did momentarily seem to lose hold of his king which I think caused the lapse.
Ah, I wasn't watching live. I played in an old-fashioned blitz tournament yesterday evening and was reminded how much harder it is than with a screen and mouse. The Grand Tour guys don't even have to worry about knocking their pint over.
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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by LawrenceCooper » Sat Jun 24, 2017 4:52 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
LawrenceCooper wrote:He did momentarily seem to lose hold of his king which I think caused the lapse.
Ah, I wasn't watching live. I played in an old-fashioned blitz tournament yesterday evening and was reminded how much harder it is than with a screen and mouse. The Grand Tour guys don't even have to worry about knocking their pint over.
I'm not sure it totally excuses him losing on time as I think he changed his mind about where to put it. I think they had about 4 seconds each but a few more moves were played before black noticed the clock. It may have contributed to him overpressing against MVL two rounds later but at least the draw with Nakamura in round 8 keeps him a point clear with just one round left today.

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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by JustinHorton » Sat Jun 24, 2017 11:47 pm

LawrenceCooper wrote:Magnus just lost on time with knight and pawn vs bishop
It was a long time ago and my memory may be inaccurate, but I believe I once did the same against Keith Arkell.
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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by Keith Arkell » Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:09 am

Yeah I also have a vague recollection of feeling mildly contrite after beating you like that, Justin - but not sufficiently contrite to refuse a similar win on time at a Hastings blitz some years later :wink:

I handed in the result as a win for me, and it was only much later in the tournament that my opponent learned that he had lost and not drawn the game.

The following year I noticed that in the FIDE rule book Stewart Reuben had actually cited that Hastings result to highlight an 'absurd' rule which had therefore needed changing. I thought the rule actually did change, but clearly not permanently judging by the Carlsen result.

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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by Paul Cooksey » Sun Jun 25, 2017 11:36 am

I think the rule is fine so long as there is some sort of increment, There is a logic in avoiding arbiters making judgments requiring chess skill.

I was watching live and it reminded me of a game I won on time this season. My opponent had been pressing, but was surprised by a drawing resource. He forgot about the clock for a few seconds and lost. I think Magnus did the same. I wouldn't be so worried about that if I was one of his fans, but the subsequent meltdown was very predictable.

Usually I am bit cautious in explaining sporting performance with pop psychology. But Magnus is so unstable after a loss I do believe he has a real problem to solve.

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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Sun Jun 25, 2017 12:40 pm

Paul Cooksey wrote: Usually I am bit cautious in explaining sporting performance with pop psychology. But Magnus is so unstable after a loss I do believe he has a real problem to solve.
Really? Has anyone looked at the statistics on his performances after a loss? Within the same tournament (i.e. not between the last round of one tournament and the first of another)? My impression, from his world championship match against Karjakin, is that he is capable of bouncing back after a loss. Maybe he tries too hard to bounce back and overpresses in the next game?

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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by David Robertson » Sun Jun 25, 2017 3:13 pm

Paul Cooksey wrote:Magnus is so unstable after a loss I do believe he has a real problem to solve.
The evidence from the Blitz event is quite striking. Carlsen was 4/4 going into the Grischuk game. Thereafter, he's gone 5/13 (last round in play). Hard to avoid the suspicion he's been badly distracted by it, at best; or mightily p!ssed off (with himself/the rules/whatever), at worst

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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by Leonard Barden » Sun Jun 25, 2017 3:19 pm

MVL and Carlsen tied on 24/36 for overall rapid and blitz.

Playoff to start very shortly.

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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by Barry Sandercock » Sun Jun 25, 2017 4:13 pm

Magnus won the first one.

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Grand Chess Tour events: Paris GCT and Leuven, Belgium

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Sun Jun 25, 2017 4:25 pm

Caruana did well in the blitz for someone who is supposed to be bad at rapid and blitz chess.