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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 1:54 pm 
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Location: Leicester
Hello,

I came across this http://tinyurl.com/blwnqe7 on a yahoo list I'm on, that discusses evolutionary psychology, googling about a bit, it appears this extraordinary situation has been on going since the 13th of last month.

The thing that worries me is, I have heard nothing about this on the BBC, ok I can understand the commercial channels not telling us this, because all they want us to be is, quiet little consumers that keep cutting our beards off and buy lots of insurance. But the BBC ^-^ We pay the BBC's wages, via the license fee, so they should have the peoples wishes at heart, one thing the people need is honest and accurate information. Who ever runs the BBC does not want us to know that society can work just the same without mortgages. It is about time we were able to elect who runs the Beeb, it sadly seems to have lost its way.

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 2:37 pm 
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Location: Hayes (Middx)
Quote:
They pardoned the mortgage of every Icelandic citizen
is cobblers, no matter how many exclamation marks you append!!!

From a reputable news source, one learns:

Quote:
Iceland has introduced a debt forgiveness plan which writes down deeply underwater mortgages to 110% of the households' pledgeable assets


Reduction to 110% of pledgeable assets is entirely a different policy to entirely wiping out mortgage debt for every citizen. One policy is backed by the IMF, the other is backed by David Icke.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 3:34 pm 
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Paul McKeown wrote:
Quote:
They pardoned the mortgage of every Icelandic citizen
is cobblers, no matter how many exclamation marks you append!!!

From a reputable news source, one learns:

Quote:
Iceland has introduced a debt forgiveness plan which writes down deeply underwater mortgages to 110% of the households' pledgeable assets


Reduction to 110% of pledgeable assets is entirely a different policy to entirely wiping out mortgage debt for every citizen. One policy is backed by the IMF, the other is backed by David Icke.


The point I wanted to make, even though the original website obviously overstated the case somewhat, was that I listen to and watch the news a lot, I had heard of none of this before. Perhaps you knew all about it before? I must be very ill informed I have never even heard of an 'underwater mortgage' before, sounds a bit wet to me.

Bet lots of English folk would love to hear about debt forgiveness, sorry I forgot, a little girl vanishing five years ago is far more important.

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 4:02 pm 
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PeterTurland wrote:
Bet lots of English folk would love to hear about debt forgiveness, sorry I forgot, a little girl vanishing five years ago is far more important.

Search the BBC News site for 'debt forgiveness' - there's a fair bit of coverage with regard to Ireland last year. I think it's reasonable to assume that if our politicians had been talking about it, the BBC would have covered it.

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 4:13 pm 
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It had been the practice in Iceland to borrow money to pay for housing in a currency other than their local money. So if you borrow 80% of the value of the property and the currency then halves or more, you end up owing 160% or more of the property value. They've developed some sort of scheme to sort this out. It's not very exciting unless you are deeply involved in the problems of foreign currency mortgages. Even the news that the world ranked number 2 and number 3 chess players have just completed a drawn match of six games might be of more news interest.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 4:32 pm 
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Roger de Coverly wrote:
It had been the practice in Iceland to borrow money to pay for housing in a currency other than their local money. So if you borrow 80% of the value of the property and the currency then halves or more, you end up owing 160% or more of the property value. They've developed some sort of scheme to sort this out. It's not very exciting unless you are deeply involved in the problems of foreign currency mortgages. Even the news that the world ranked number 2 and number 3 chess players have just completed a drawn match of six games might be of more news interest.


I must admit I know fairly little about money, it often seems very mysterious to me, like government debt for instance. Surely with the enormous power our government has, it can have a printing press built and just print the stuff, why it has to borrow it off some loan shark somewhere, baffles me. After all if it can declare war on another country willy nilly, it can get us Brits, our own money printing machine, but there again what do I know?

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 5:55 pm 
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One hopes a missing child might yet be found.
The missing money will never be found because it was fictional - the proof of that is to be seen all around. The financiers' confidence trick failed and they are having to auswage their insatiable hunger & thirst at the public food bank, while still privately snacking juicy bonuses.
Surely mortgage relief on a 110% of realisable assets is of some help to ordinary Icelanders who may otherwise face bankruptcy?

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Last edited by John McKenna on Fri May 04, 2012 7:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 6:35 pm 
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John McKenna wrote:
One hopes a missing child might yet be found.
The missing money will never be found because it was fictional - the proof of that is to be seen all around. The financiers' confidence trick failed and they are having to auswage their insatiable hunger & thirst at the public food bank, while still privately snacking juicy bonuses.
Surely mortage relief on a 110% of realisable assets is of some help to ordinary Icelanders who may otherwise face bankruptcy?


This gets stranger and stranger, I've just had a careful look at a £20 note, I had to get a magnifying glass because the small print is very small, the whole thing is just one vast con. Would you believe it, it is not the real thing, what a cheek! The piece of paper actually says "I promise to pay the bearer on demand the sum of twenty pounds" So what I've actually got is just an IOU. So what I would like to know is, who do I give this piece of paper to, with the picture of the queen on it, to get my real twenty quid?

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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2012 9:26 pm 
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P Turland >... who do I give this piece of paper (£20 note) to... to get my real twenty quid?<
BoE used to promise an equivalent in gold (now most of the world's mined gold is in US Gov. coffers).
Go to a commodity trader and buy an equivalent amount of commodities but you'll need considerably more than £20 to make it viable.
As long as people have confidence in that 'piece of paper' it'll continue to be of value. But, are there enough commodities in the world to back all the money in it? I'd like to know.

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PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2012 7:26 am 
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PeterTurland wrote:
Roger de Coverly wrote:
It had been the practice in Iceland to borrow money to pay for housing in a currency other than their local money. So if you borrow 80% of the value of the property and the currency then halves or more, you end up owing 160% or more of the property value. They've developed some sort of scheme to sort this out. It's not very exciting unless you are deeply involved in the problems of foreign currency mortgages. Even the news that the world ranked number 2 and number 3 chess players have just completed a drawn match of six games might be of more news interest.


I must admit I know fairly little about money, it often seems very mysterious to me, like government debt for instance. Surely with the enormous power our government has, it can have a printing press built and just print the stuff, why it has to borrow it off some loan shark somewhere, baffles me. After all if it can declare war on another country willy nilly, it can get us Brits, our own money printing machine, but there again what do I know?


Er, they can, but it's not generally a very good idea/born of desperation...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation


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PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2012 4:48 pm 
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The money machine has been in in operation since the 2008 financial meltdown in several countries (US, UK, Japan, etc.) and its official name here is Quantatitive Easing (QE for short). It is being done to increase the money supply (see the Wiki article Richard links to above) and is very different thing from Peter's original point - debt forgiven to specific debtors in Iceland - it indirectly forgives the debt of all debtors in the country concerned including the biggest single one, i.e. the government.
Well that's OK, you may think - since the government debt is a national one, which has been spent by the said government on our behalf - but it erodes the value of savings and pensions of those in the country who have not borrowed to the hilt to get ahead. When QE is combined with ultra-low interest rates it is a 'double whammy' on those who did the right thing and saved but 'double bubble' for those who did the wrong thing by borrowing beyond their means without factoring in a possible collapse of the financial system - as they are being bailed out by the rest.

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