4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Venues, fixtures, teams and related matters.

Which three matches do you want to see on the live boards for round 4 of the 4NCL?

WGHK 1 - Barbican 4NCL 1
16
28%
BCM Dragons - Cambridge Uni 1
2
3%
e2e4.org.uk 1 - Cheddleton 1
17
29%
Guildford 2 - Sambuca Sharks
1
2%
Jutes of Kent - Guildford 1
12
21%
WGHK 2 - Warwickshire Select 1
3
5%
White Rose 1 - Barbican 4NCL 2
3
5%
South Wales Dragons - Blackthorne Russia
4
7%
 
Total votes: 58

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Christopher Kreuzer
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4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:56 pm

An attempt to run a poll to decide which of the pairings for the 4NCL round 4 in division 1 should be on the live boards. I think there are enough live boards to cover three matches, so I've set the poll to allow voters to select 3 options. The poll for round 4 has to be done separately, as the limit is 15 options. I'll link the two polls.

Fixture information from here:

http://www.4ncl.co.uk/1213_fixdiv1.htm

Poll has been left open-ended, but voting before the weekend of 12-13th January would help! I hope one of the forum moderators can make this poll sticky so it appears at the top of the list of topics, at least for a while. I've also enabled re-voting if people change their minds.

Oh, one important proviso, this is just a poll to gauge opinion on these boards. I don't have any influence over what matches will end up being shown live! Which might make the poll seem a bit pointless, but if enough people vote...

Round 3 poll:

http://www.ecforum.org.uk/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=4960

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Greg Breed
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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Greg Breed » Wed Nov 07, 2012 10:30 am

WGHK 1 - Barbican 4NCL 1
e2e4.org.uk 1 - Cheddleton 1
Jutes of Kent - Guildford 1

...seem to be the pick of the bunch and almost a dead cert'!
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Matthew Turner
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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Matthew Turner » Wed Nov 07, 2012 10:56 am

You have to decide what is the point of the live boards? The best two teams are Guildford and Wood Green, so if you want the best players on the live boards then they will always feature every match. However, I think it is nice that some lesser teams get their moment in the limelight, so particularly in the first few weekends it seems a good idea to me to share it around.

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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Mick Norris » Wed Nov 07, 2012 11:06 am

Presumably it can be arranged so that each Div 1 team gets at least 1 match on the live boards over the first 2 weekends?

It might then be an idea to feature crucial div 2 and 3 games later in the season
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Jonathan Rogers
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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Wed Nov 07, 2012 11:26 am

I agree that all div 1 teams should feature at some point. You also want close matches, so it is better to show the lesser teams when they are playing each other and have something real at stake. The trouble with that is that the weaker teams play each other on the same day that the title-chasing teams play each other ....

But this can be avoided. There is no reason why you must have all seeds v non-seeds on Saturday (and have very few matches suitable for live viewing) and then seeds v seeds and non-seeds v non-non-seeds on Sunday (when most of the matches may be worth showing). It is possible to mix it up a bit, and that is exactly what Richard Furness did some ten years ago when I suggested it to him. (There were no live games then but John Saunders and others used to comment on how one-sided the Saturday matches could be). Unfortunately this idea was lost along with Richard himself.

So, for this last weekend, for example, we could have had

Saturday

Jutes of Kent v White Rose
South Wales Dragons v Wood Green 2
Guildford v Barbican 2
Blackthorne v Warwickshire

and the other four matches as played (seeds v non-seeds)

Sunday

Barbican 2 v Blackthorne
Warwickshire v Guildford
White Rose v SW Dragons
Wood Green 2 v Jutes of Kent

and the other four matches as played (seeds v seeds and non-seeds v non-seeds)

If you do this, then you can show all four matches between seeded teams in a weekend (because there would be two such matches each day, rather than all four on the same day) and the non-seeded teams will have at least one match (more likely two) per season - and several more if they break through to the championship pool.

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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Chris Rice » Thu Nov 08, 2012 9:00 am

Why do we have to be fair? Isn't the idea to give the public what they want? The poll (btw great idea Chris Kreuzer) currently shows that there is not one person who wants to see the Wood Green 2 v Warwickshire Select match so why waste Dave Clayton's more than valuable time in covering that? Clearly what the public want at the moment is to see the e2e4.org.uk 1 - Cheddleton 1 match and another possible giant killing act by Sean's men. If I wasn't busy trying to get my mostly-made-of-wine players to the Jutes v Guildford 1 match I'd be on the internet watching that one myself.

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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Nick Thomas » Thu Nov 08, 2012 9:13 am

Chris Rice wrote:there is not one person who wants to see the Wood Green 2 v Warwickshire Select match so why waste Dave Clayton's more than valuable time in covering that?.
:shock:

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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Alex McFarlane » Thu Nov 08, 2012 9:36 am

Let me understand if I have the gist of this thread.

People are getting a service for which they personally are paying nothing. They would prefer that this service was 'improved' by giving games chosen by them rather than the service provider.

If I have got this wrong then I apologise.

I'm pretty sure that if someone was willing to pay for similar service they would have considerable say in which games were broadcast. Currently I suspect that the costs are covered by the players taking part. As such they deserve their moment of fame.

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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by David Sedgwick » Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:32 am

Alex McFarlane wrote:Let me understand if I have the gist of this thread.

People are getting a service for which they personally are paying nothing. They would prefer that this service was 'improved' by giving games chosen by them rather than the service provider.

If I have got this wrong then I apologise.

I'm pretty sure that if someone was willing to pay for similar service they would have considerable say in which games were broadcast. Currently I suspect that the costs are covered by the players taking part. As such they deserve their moment of fame.
I would be inclined to agree with you were we talking about a selection of games from a tournament.

However, in the case of the 4NCL, I would imagine that a large majority of the audience (admittedly not all) comprises people who make a contribution in one way or another: players at the other venue, non-playing captains, players not playing that particular weekend, people who help to finance their club's participation, journalists who publicise the event.

Moreover, the service is also financed by those who give up their time for nothing to enable it to happen. Carl Hibbard is one of those people. He's quite entitled to allow this poll on his Forum if he so wishes.

Most of those who have posted up thread know a fair bit about the 4NCL and have given significant support to it. The relevant powers that be (are you one of them?) can ignore this thread if they wish. Or they can listen, as the late Richard Furness did.

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Carl Hibbard » Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:42 am

David Sedgwick wrote:Moreover, the service is also financed by those who give up their time for nothing to enable it to happen. Carl Hibbard is one of those people. He's quite entitled to allow this poll on his Forum if he so wishes.
If Dave Clayton has three lots of boards then perhaps a vote on the third match is acceptable, the other two should be whatever the biggest clashes are that weekend :!:
Cheers
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Alex McFarlane
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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Alex McFarlane » Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:55 am

David,

I don't think we are a million miles apart in our thinking. I have nothing to do with the selection of matches for broadcast by the way. If fixtures can be arranged for a more favourable broadcast then that is fine but a poll on which games to show will almost certainly lead to the top teams being broadcast to the exclusion of others - many of the others you highlight. Second teams like to see their first teams playing for example. In Scotland the policy is that the live boards are shared around for the reasons you give (the Scottish Open is the one exception to this). Indeed that was a major reason in going for WiFi boards, to allow flexibility.

I do not think a poll is productive in this respect. The consultation with captains might be more so but I am not totally convinced. My worry is that people on this forum will say that they wanted to watch a certain match and instead of appreciating what they are actually getting there will be complaints.

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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by LawrenceCooper » Thu Nov 08, 2012 3:20 pm

Carl Hibbard wrote:
David Sedgwick wrote:Moreover, the service is also financed by those who give up their time for nothing to enable it to happen. Carl Hibbard is one of those people. He's quite entitled to allow this poll on his Forum if he so wishes.
If Dave Clayton has three lots of boards then perhaps a vote on the third match is acceptable, the other two should be whatever the biggest clashes are that weekend :!:
Like Cheddleton v Barbican :wink:

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Carl Hibbard » Thu Nov 08, 2012 3:24 pm

I would like to see a Ben Purton struggling again as Black board but then that is perhaps just me?
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David Sedgwick
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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by David Sedgwick » Thu Nov 08, 2012 4:00 pm

Alex McFarlane wrote:David,

I don't think we are a million miles apart in our thinking. I have nothing to do with the selection of matches for broadcast by the way. If fixtures can be arranged for a more favourable broadcast then that is fine but a poll on which games to show will almost certainly lead to the top teams being broadcast to the exclusion of others - many of the others you highlight. Second teams like to see their first teams playing for example. In Scotland the policy is that the live boards are shared around for the reasons you give (the Scottish Open is the one exception to this). Indeed that was a major reason in going for WiFi boards, to allow flexibility.

I do not think a poll is productive in this respect. The consultation with captains might be more so but I am not totally convinced. My worry is that people on this forum will say that they wanted to watch a certain match and instead of appreciating what they are actually getting there will be complaints.
Alex,

You seem to be concerned that a poll on this forum may not be representative of the views of the community being served. That is undeniably true, but I don't see that the point has any greater validity than in respect of any other thread on here. Such considerations have led some to call for a boycott of the forum by people in positions of responsibility and one or two such people have indeed withdrawn from it. However, that's not an approach which you have hitherto supported; on the contrary you've used, and continue to use, this forum to express your opinions and feelings on a number of issues. So why shouldn't other members be allowed to say what they'd like to see broadcast from the 4NCL? It seems a pretty innocuous subject to me.

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Re: 4NCL live boards poll (round 4)

Post by Andrew Bak » Thu Nov 08, 2012 7:15 pm

David Sedgwick wrote:So why shouldn't other members be allowed to say what they'd like to see broadcast from the 4NCL? It seems a pretty innocuous subject to me.
I agree with this. There has never been any suggestion that this poll is any way official, not even endorsed by the 4NCL. I guess if the 4NCL organisers see it fit to base their selections on the results of the polls, then that's their prerogative.

For what it's worth, I think that all the teams should get at least one game on the internet boards and with three matches being broadcast, this should be quite easy to achieve without missing any of the key matchups for the Championship and Relegation.

I remember in 2010/11 they broadcast the final Division 3 matchup on the live boards on the final round. Perhaps a similar thing could be done this year with a key Promotion Pool match in Division 2 for example?

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