Random Ratings Everywhere

Venues, fixtures, teams and related matters.
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Joey Stewart
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Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by Joey Stewart » Sun Mar 20, 2016 6:35 pm

I dont get why so many players this season are using estimate ratings - I thought that those were just for the purpose of upfloating rapidly improving juniors so they get a better chance, but not so half the league can make up ratings even though they almost all have real fide grades.
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.

MartinCarpenter
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by MartinCarpenter » Sun Mar 20, 2016 7:06 pm

Because the FIDE grades are (for an awful lot people - different in div 1!) simply vastly less reliable than the ECF grades. Based on far fewer games.

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Joey Stewart
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by Joey Stewart » Sun Mar 20, 2016 7:37 pm

I know fide ratings are a massive mess, but I still think they should take priority - it is frustrating to get results and find your opponent was 100+ points lower then you expected.
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.

MartinCarpenter
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by MartinCarpenter » Sun Mar 20, 2016 7:40 pm

Well, just mentally rate yourself against their ECF then :) The +- should roughly cancel themselves out.

If you forced teams in Div3 to use the FIDE grades then you'd very likely force some clearly wrong board orders.

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IM Jack Rudd
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by IM Jack Rudd » Sun Mar 20, 2016 7:45 pm

I don't mind the use of conversions for board order purposes, but I would like the team sheets to display players' ratings as well. It's annoying to not know your opponent's rating in a FIDE-rated game.

Alex Holowczak
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by Alex Holowczak » Sun Mar 20, 2016 8:01 pm

Joey Stewart wrote:I dont get why so many players this season are using estimate ratings
On the pairing sheets, "e" stands for ECF conversion, not estimate.

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Joey Stewart
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by Joey Stewart » Sun Mar 20, 2016 8:04 pm

I dont want converted ratings - not unless I am going to get that number used for calculating my rating change.
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.

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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by Alex Holowczak » Sun Mar 20, 2016 8:10 pm

Joey Stewart wrote:I dont want converted ratings - not unless I am going to get that number used for calculating my rating change.
Well, the captains did, and IT man had to decide how best to do it.

They weighed up which number should be shown, and concluded that the number being used for the tournament should be shown, on the grounds that:
(a) There'd be all sorts of 80-point rule breach observations, which would be spurious.
(b) Eventually there'd be a genuine 80-point breach that everyone missed, but no one noticed because everyone assumed would just be because of the presented numbers.

I don't know why both numbers can't be shown, but the IT person can be asked. Has anyone actually asked him?

There's 90 minutes between publication, so it doesn't seem to me to be too onerous to look up the player's rating on a computer/phone.

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Joey Stewart
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by Joey Stewart » Sun Mar 20, 2016 8:15 pm

Why is it that only "some" players even get the luxury of getting these converted ratings anyway - I would love to have a big fat 2260 (or whatever 200 is converting to these days) in front of my name and command a bit of respect
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.

Ian Thompson
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by Ian Thompson » Sun Mar 20, 2016 8:39 pm

Joey Stewart wrote:Why is it that only "some" players even get the luxury of getting these converted ratings anyway
because their team manager opted for it.
Joey Stewart wrote:I would love to have a big fat 2260 (or whatever 200 is converting to these days) in front of my name and command a bit of respect
I think you'd have to settle for a nice round 2200 (200 * 7.5 +700)

MartinCarpenter
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by MartinCarpenter » Sun Mar 20, 2016 9:46 pm

Wonder if 200 is even quite worth that now the inflation has got up to that level. Several of the 2200's I can think of round Yorkshire are running closer to 210 ECF nowadays.

Richard Bates
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by Richard Bates » Sun Mar 20, 2016 10:10 pm

MartinCarpenter wrote:Because the FIDE grades are (for an awful lot people - different in div 1!) simply vastly less reliable than the ECF grades. Based on far fewer games.
It'll all sort itself out once the ECF reforms the grading system to match FIDE's level of unreliability.

NickFaulks
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by NickFaulks » Mon Mar 21, 2016 7:40 am

Richard Bates wrote:
MartinCarpenter wrote:Because the FIDE grades are (for an awful lot people - different in div 1!) simply vastly less reliable than the ECF grades. Based on far fewer games.
It'll all sort itself out once the ECF reforms the grading system to match FIDE's level of unreliability.
It is unfair to criticise the FIDE rating system for failing to take into account games which are not reported to them.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by Roger de Coverly » Mon Mar 21, 2016 8:55 am

NickFaulks wrote: It is unfair to criticise the FIDE rating system for failing to take into account games which are not reported to them.
It is however fair to criticise the FIDE rating system when it would refuse to rate games, even if they were submitted. The simple fact is that in the UK, a lot of chess is played at time limits where the whole game is scheduled to take place in a period longer than two hours and less than four hours.

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Re: Random Ratings Everywhere

Post by Alex Holowczak » Mon Mar 21, 2016 9:08 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:
NickFaulks wrote: It is unfair to criticise the FIDE rating system for failing to take into account games which are not reported to them.
It is however fair to criticise the FIDE rating system when it would refuse to rate games, even if they were submitted. The simple fact is that in the UK, a lot of chess is played at time limits where the whole game is scheduled to take place in a period longer than two hours and less than four hours.
Or indeed have a time control at something other than move 40.

However, there seemed to be a move to change the first of these two problems in the next set of regulations.

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