Chess Masters: the Endgame

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Nick Ivell
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Nick Ivell » Wed Apr 02, 2025 4:27 pm

The programme is clearly not designed for juniors. As for Asian juniors, the ones I saw at Blackpool recently could actually play chess, unlike most of the Endgame crowd.

Mark Hannon
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Mark Hannon » Wed Apr 02, 2025 4:30 pm

Matt Mackenzie wrote:
Wed Apr 02, 2025 3:16 pm
Nick Ivell wrote:
Wed Apr 02, 2025 10:32 am
James Delingpole not impressed in his Spectator review, but I don't sense he knows anything about chess.
Tbh "anything about anything" is arguably more appropriate in his case :)
I’ve met some very able Old Etonians but on trying to read one of Delingpoles’s novels did get the impression it would never have been published had it been authored by someone from a less reputable educational institution.

Nick Ivell
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Nick Ivell » Wed Apr 02, 2025 4:47 pm

The one to read in the Speccie is McShane. Chess just happened to get a mention in the TV review.

When it comes to cooking, everyone, in a sense, is an amateur cook; so even bad cooking holds interest.

I can't help but think that chess is different, and that skittles games are hardly worth analysing, and that Howell is wasted at this level.

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Joey Stewart
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Joey Stewart » Wed Apr 02, 2025 9:56 pm

Mark Hannon wrote:
Wed Apr 02, 2025 4:21 pm
If you watch “Bake Off , The Professionals” on TV you’ll see the contestants on there are at a totally different level to those on the regular Bake Off. In an analogous way to how the contestants in The Master Game stand in comparison to Chess Masters|The Endgame.

Even the regular bake off contestants generally come across as pretty competent in their craft with the finalists being exceptionally talented for amaturs. Certainly I'd rate their baking skills as being well above the equivalent level of chess skills being showcased in this.
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Nick Ivell
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Nick Ivell » Thu Apr 03, 2025 3:40 pm

Same here. To me these players have picked up their skills online, but not really put in the hard yards which I am still old-fashioned enough to believe are necessary, if only because I put them in.

Mick Norris
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Mick Norris » Thu Apr 03, 2025 5:18 pm

Kel has played over 100 ECF rated games OTB
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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Thu Apr 03, 2025 6:49 pm

Mick is right. There are several contestants, who if the proper research was done, you could lay out their ECF rating history, and show that they do deserve to be taken seriously. But that begs the question: what are you trying to measure? There is a tension here between trying to compare the contestants to 'traditional' chess norms and values, the purely social side of chess, and the burgeoning phenomenon of online chess.

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Thu Apr 03, 2025 6:57 pm

Nick Ivell wrote:
Wed Apr 02, 2025 4:47 pm
The one to read in the Speccie is McShane. Chess just happened to get a mention in the TV review.

When it comes to cooking, everyone, in a sense, is an amateur cook; so even bad cooking holds interest.

I can't help but think that chess is different, and that skittles games are hardly worth analysing, and that Howell is wasted at this level.
Coming back to this. Yes, skittles games (casual games) are hardly worth analysing, but to the contestants these are not skittles games. Which leads on to how do you introduce new people to the norms of chess culture as played 'seriously'?

Compare the average chess club evening with this social scene:

https://www.reference-point.uk/whats-on/hockney
Every Wednesday night from 630pm-11, we host our chess night. All abilities and all ages are welcome as we play a series of 10 minute games, moving up a ladder system so abilities end matched with similar abilities to them. Cocktails and music accompany the games.
https://www.growhackney.co.uk/events-ca ... hess-music
FRANKIE’s chess club is a weekly nomadic club founded and supported by music lovers. Always on the move, the chess club has reached different bars, pubs, venues and gardens in east London bringing along a selection of eclectic chess boards and experimental records.
https://www.tate.org.uk/whats-on/tate-m ... and-boards
Join us for an evening of music and board games curated by DJ and writer Haseeb Iqbal

Combining board games, music as well as themed nights and performances, Iqbal's new residency is a space for an array of interests to intersperse. He will be soundtracking the evenings, journeying through the depths of his record collection as a selection of board games will be on offer to play. From scrabble, ludo and chess to Ghanian board game Oware and South Asian tabletop game Carrom, this will be a night to stimulate all the senses
[I think you have to pay for that!]

https://www.theculturecrypt.com/intervi ... -interview
Through chess, we embody this concept by allowing people of all ages and walks of life to compete in the leagues and make music playlists every week. Every last Tuesday of the month, for example, we spotlight people competing in the leagues and people curating the playlists. A community is an ecosystem. Everyone within a community plays an active role in some shape or form, directly or indirectly and sustains that community."
How good, or 'serious' is the chess in those spaces? You might get some amazing games. You might not. Probably not the point.

Anyway, I was really going to agree with Nick that David Howell is slightly wasted at this level. But he is developing visibility, which is good.

Mark Hannon
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Mark Hannon » Thu Apr 03, 2025 7:32 pm

The events Christopher lists sound great

Mick Norris
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Mick Norris » Fri Apr 04, 2025 9:21 am

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
Thu Apr 03, 2025 6:49 pm
Mick is right
:lol:

Leonard in the Guardian
Meanwhile, BBC Two’s programme Chess Masters: The Endgame reached its fourth episode (of eight) at 8pm on Monday. Viewing figures, supplied by Broadcast, have stabilised. Numbers are marginally up, from 655,000 to 660,000, representing 5.4% of the viewing audience against 5.0% the previous week. The Magnus Carlsen memory test in episode three will be repeated for the new contestants in episode six.
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Phil Neatherway
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Phil Neatherway » Fri Apr 04, 2025 4:45 pm

Thalia has played in the 4NCL.


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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Fri Apr 04, 2025 5:51 pm

Not sure if the full name of Kel has been posted before, but it is public knowledge here:

https://www.bolton.ac.uk/news/universit ... bc-tv-show

University of Greater Manchester chess ace Kelechi makes his move on brain-bending BBC TV show

This is in a similar vein to other articles brought out on the back of publicity for the BBC TV show.
Chess ace Kelechi Nkwonta will be showing off his moves on national TV next week. Kelechi, who works at the University of Greater Manchester, will be one of the talented players featured on the BBC2 show Chess Masters: The Endgame on Monday 31 March.
Sad part to the back story here:
His sister Chinwe, also an accomplished player, who died five years ago, encouraged him to keep playing “as she knew I was even better than her”.
This is his rating card on the ECF Rating site:

https://rating.englishchess.org.uk/v2/n ... de=351425A

(For some reason, there is a different spelling of his first name: Kelechukwu.)

Do we know how many of the players have actual official ECF ratings?

(And how many of them will make YouTube video podcasts of their games before the show is finished?! - see the link Loz just posted for Craig 'The Python' analysing his game against Kel!)

jholyhead
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by jholyhead » Fri Apr 04, 2025 7:15 pm

"Hard yards". I needed a chuckle, so thanks for that.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Chess Masters: the Endgame

Post by Roger de Coverly » Fri Apr 04, 2025 7:47 pm

There's an admission that he had never played five minute chess.

I think the move rate they were playing to was ten minutes with 5 second increments. Under FIDE and ECF rating rules, that's Rapidplay rather then Blitz. What we didn't see much of was how long they were taking over individual moves.

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