In addition to...
-
- Posts: 276
- Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2014 11:51 pm
- Location: West Bend,WI USA
In addition to...
the current draw protocols I propose a draw be automatic once both combatants have requested a draw
I float like a pawn island and sting like an ignored knight
-
- Posts: 2069
- Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2014 1:28 pm
- Location: Morecambe, Europe
Re: In addition to...
That means if I were first to be offered a draw I would invariably refuse. If I went on to win, well and good. If at a later stage in the game I found myself to be losing still well and good. I would offer a draw myself and lo and behold it is guaranteed!
-
- Posts: 7218
- Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 10:29 am
- Location: Cove, Hampshire, England.
Re: In addition to...
The phrase "Back to the drawing board" springs to mind.Steven DuCharme wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:23 pmthe current draw protocols I propose a draw be automatic once both combatants have requested a draw
British Chess News : britishchessnews.com
Twitter: @BritishChess
Facebook: facebook.com/groups/britishchess
Twitter: @BritishChess
Facebook: facebook.com/groups/britishchess
-
- Posts: 5237
- Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 11:51 pm
- Location: Millom, Cumbria
Re: In addition to...
Well this looks like being a short thread
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)
-
- Posts: 3338
- Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2008 8:27 pm
Re: In addition to...
It’s not actually as stupid as the ridicule would imply IMO. It could obviously be tweaked eg. the draw must be offered back within a fixed period, eg. 20 moves but if the aim is to avoid draws before the game was effectively played out it would be reasonably effective.
-
- Posts: 2069
- Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2014 1:28 pm
- Location: Morecambe, Europe
Re: In addition to...
I meant to tease, not to ridicule. If it gave offence to Steven then I apologise - it was not my intention.Richard Bates wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:37 amIt’s not actually as stupid as the ridicule would imply IMO.
-
- Posts: 211
- Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2007 8:22 pm
- Location: Wakefield
Re: In addition to...
As someone who gets annoyed by people offering draws when they are clearly worse (even if it's not my game!), I would welcome any ideas to put a stop to it. At the moment there is no downside.
So how about this idea which I've just thought of: If someone offers a draw and goes on to lose they should score -0.5. If this rule was in place nobody would offer a draw if there was any realistic chance of losing which in my opinion is how it should be. Is there something in this or is it just nonsense?
So how about this idea which I've just thought of: If someone offers a draw and goes on to lose they should score -0.5. If this rule was in place nobody would offer a draw if there was any realistic chance of losing which in my opinion is how it should be. Is there something in this or is it just nonsense?
-
- Posts: 5237
- Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 11:51 pm
- Location: Millom, Cumbria
Re: In addition to...
If it happens just once, smile and play on (you don't even *have* to say anything)Peter Shaw wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:45 amAs someone who gets annoyed by people offering draws when they are clearly worse (even if it's not my game!), I would welcome any ideas to put a stop to it. At the moment there is no downside
Anybody who does it on a repeated basis is potentially breaching the laws of the game - and in a tournament a complaint to the arbiter would not be inappropriate. This is admittedly not possible in a league match, but in that case just firmly tell them to stop doing it?
(though to put it in context, only rarely has even the first happened in my personal experience - and the latter scenario never)
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)
-
- Posts: 10364
- Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:06 am
- Location: Somewhere you're not
Re: In addition to...
It's happened to me a few times. There's not always been much point in complaining to the arbiter as their willingness to intervene varies quite a lot.
That said, I don't have any objection to people offering a draw when they're much worse. Why is that not a legitimate ploy?
That said, I don't have any objection to people offering a draw when they're much worse. Why is that not a legitimate ploy?
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."
lostontime.blogspot.com
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."
lostontime.blogspot.com
-
- Posts: 21315
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:51 pm
Re: In addition to...
It can be done as a bluff by much higher rated or stronger players when they think they are worse. If the weaker or lower rated players, do you take the draw and regret the opportunity to play for the win or decide discretion is the better part of valour? Match and tournament status can influence the decision as well.JustinHorton wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:22 pmThat said, I don't have any objection to people offering a draw when they're much worse. Why is that not a legitimate ploy?
The convention many players would follow is that if an initial offer of a draw is declined, you don't make another one unless the position has materially changed.
Contriving a repetition can sometimes be the easiest way of offering a draw.
-
- Posts: 5833
- Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:28 pm
Re: In addition to...
"The convention many players would follow is that if an initial offer of a draw is declined, you don't make another one unless the position has materially changed."
I agree. Re Justin's comment, if I were arbiting and someone made repeated draw offers, I would treat it as a distraction. Of course you are relying on both players marking it on the score-sheet, or the offender telling the truth when asked...
I had a CC game a couple of years ago where an opponent offered draws on successive moves (in a lost position). I complained to the controller, who said he would do something if it happened again. The next draw offer came on the next move, so I claimed the game. The controller said that I couldn't claim the game, but he would warn the opponent. I told him that was not good enough. By now, I had discovered he played for the same club as the opponent! Anyway, I won a few moves later. Shortly after that ICCF introduced a rule, that as everyone now plays on a server, that if you offer a draw, the server does not allow you to offer another draw unless your opponent has offered me one in the mean time. Maybe that should be extended to OTB chess.
A friend suggests introducing a doubling cube, as in Backgammon, but added that it only works for 1 to 1 matches, else an 8 board match could finish 256-256!
I agree. Re Justin's comment, if I were arbiting and someone made repeated draw offers, I would treat it as a distraction. Of course you are relying on both players marking it on the score-sheet, or the offender telling the truth when asked...
I had a CC game a couple of years ago where an opponent offered draws on successive moves (in a lost position). I complained to the controller, who said he would do something if it happened again. The next draw offer came on the next move, so I claimed the game. The controller said that I couldn't claim the game, but he would warn the opponent. I told him that was not good enough. By now, I had discovered he played for the same club as the opponent! Anyway, I won a few moves later. Shortly after that ICCF introduced a rule, that as everyone now plays on a server, that if you offer a draw, the server does not allow you to offer another draw unless your opponent has offered me one in the mean time. Maybe that should be extended to OTB chess.
A friend suggests introducing a doubling cube, as in Backgammon, but added that it only works for 1 to 1 matches, else an 8 board match could finish 256-256!
-
- Posts: 8466
- Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:28 pm
Re: In addition to...
That is an old idea and in my view not at all a bad one. In fact, I could claim to have originated it, although I'm sure that many others could say the same. It has never gained traction.Kevin Thurlow wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 4:25 pmA friend suggests introducing a doubling cube, as in Backgammon
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a QR code stamped on a human face — forever.
-
- Posts: 1838
- Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:16 am
Re: In addition to...
I think that a dubious draw offer should be rebuffed with you must be joking I am expecting you to resign. Many make the offer silently so ought to speak up!
-
- Posts: 4549
- Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 11:04 pm
- Location: writer
Re: In addition to...
It has previously been suggested that:
A draw offer cannot be retracted for 5 moves
A draw offer can only be retracted afer making a positive declaration, presumably after moving and before pressing the clock.
Recently I was offered a draw and laughed. Unfortunately I later blundered and it was eventually drawn.
Ron Rushbrook, probably in the 1950s, did suggest you could offer your opponent a fraction of the point. Perhaps 0.6 or 0.2. Then you could haggle. That would make Swiss Pairings simpler and more interesting, title norms different and prize distribution less complex.
A draw offer cannot be retracted for 5 moves
A draw offer can only be retracted afer making a positive declaration, presumably after moving and before pressing the clock.
Recently I was offered a draw and laughed. Unfortunately I later blundered and it was eventually drawn.
Ron Rushbrook, probably in the 1950s, did suggest you could offer your opponent a fraction of the point. Perhaps 0.6 or 0.2. Then you could haggle. That would make Swiss Pairings simpler and more interesting, title norms different and prize distribution less complex.