Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

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John McKenna
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Re: Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

Post by John McKenna » Wed May 29, 2019 9:21 am

MJMcCready wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 1:52 am
It's all about money.
It revolves around money - as now do most man-made things - but there's a bit more to it than just the coins.
To find a for(u)m that accommodates the mess, that is the task of the artist now. (Samuel Beckett)

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Michael Farthing
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Re: Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

Post by Michael Farthing » Wed May 29, 2019 10:32 am

I doubt that many coins change hands, but a slight rewrite might make the sentence more plausible:

It revolves around money - as now do most man-made things - but there's more to it than just the bit coins.

John McKenna
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Re: Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

Post by John McKenna » Wed May 29, 2019 2:04 pm

Sterling wordsmith work, Michael!

And, the whole point about those itty-bitty bitcoins is that they don't physically change hands.

By the way, I've now realised that MJM could be a latter-day Spartan -
… He commanded that all gold and silver coin should be called in, and that only a sort of iron should be current, a great weight and quantity of which was but of very little worth - so that to lay up twenty or thirty pounds (sterling) required a pretty large closet and to remove it nothing less than a yoke of oxen...[/quote ] [Plutarch on Lycurgus, Spartan lawgiver]

https://coinweek.com/ancient-coins/anci ... tan-coins/
To find a for(u)m that accommodates the mess, that is the task of the artist now. (Samuel Beckett)

MJMcCready
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Re: Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

Post by MJMcCready » Thu May 30, 2019 1:50 am

No chance of being a latter day Spartan I'm afraid. Too many years of reading Plato as an under-grad and post-grad prevents such matters [if you aren't sure what I am alluding to here then its that Athens lost to Sparta and was in ruins. A defeated Athens was what much of Socrates' inquiries were based around in Plato's texts The Republic being the most obvious example.] It's more to do with being abroad for so long and rather cynical about the chess playing elite and their motivations.

I do enjoy watching Open tournaments where there a greater incentive on winning but closed tournaments between people who play each other far too frequently, and only do so for money far less inspiring. It's a great shame that more attention isn't given to the wealth of Grandmasters who play more interesting chess. There are times where following the game at the highest level is not a good idea...well there are better options available. Many people come to Britain with their hand out, we had four more turn up, the pretext being professional chess this time around.

Mick Norris
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Re: Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

Post by Mick Norris » Thu May 30, 2019 8:37 am

Any postings on here represent my personal views and should not be taken as representative of the Manchester Chess Federation www.manchesterchess.co.uk

Geoff Chandler
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Re: Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

Post by Geoff Chandler » Thu May 30, 2019 12:07 pm

Hi Mick and Mark, (and Mike!)

It was a business promotion event, a showpieces where they used chess players instead footballers or minor celebs.
A flat across the board appearance fee to turn up and play chess to promote whiskey. Carlsen won 250 bottles of whisky!

It also raised the profile of chess in Scotland (even though they held it on the same weekend as the Scottish Cup Final.)
and gave more than just a few Scottish juniors and a whole load of other people cherished memories. Me included.

('I went to Princes Street gardens for the blitz sessions [2pm-5pm Thursday and Sunday throughout the summer]
all the time people were showing me their mobile pictures of them with the stars.)

I'm with you 100% about closed shop tournaments with organisers vying for the strongest ever tournament based on rating.
I would prefer just 2-3 top dogs and the rest made up of under top 50 players and one local player.
Then we get to see the top lads unleash there undoubted skills and we are entertained.

The down side would be the bean counters (those that worship the four digits) sneering at winning such
an event because the tournament would have a low category. I don't think these people follow or even look
at the games. You can tell by their comments their only interest is the result and the effect on the grade.

"Many people come to Britain with their hand out, we had four more turn up, the pretext being professional chess this time around."

This ball has been rolled across the goal line so many times in this thread it appears I've been invited to tap it in.

The four that turned up at the London Classic, 'The Fantastic Four.' come to mind. They played just two classical games.

1st £93,000
2nd £62,000
3rd £46,000
4th £30,000

Elsewhere on this site we see a plea from Hastings for £15,000 to keep going.
(I knew Hastings was in financial trouble when I had my infamous rant about the 'classic' in December viewtopic.php?f=2&t=9994#p225446
I did not want to mention it or out them before they were ready to announce it. )

Hastings, The Drunken Knights, Edinburgh's celebrated Wandering Dragons who have done more than their
fair share of raising the profile of Chess in Scotland (struggling to find a financially viable venue).
Scotland losing it's meagre £2,000 grant. There will be a lot more tournaments and clubs struggling
to keep the game alive. The real big money is going in the wrong direction.

I see Hastings are asking for donations. http://www.hastingschess.club/
But don't see how. A PayPal link would be OK so I can get rid of some of the E-Bay money before she (Mrs. C)
squanders it on shoes, coats, handbags and curtains...(every now and then I'm allowed to buy a 2nd chess book.)

MJMcCready
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Re: Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

Post by MJMcCready » Fri May 31, 2019 2:29 pm

Yes and apologies for my cynicism but the modern game is a rather complex beast and those who just assume those at its apogee are most worthy of following need a very firm kick up the bum imo. Modern day Britain is such a free for all, the difference between professional chess players and uneducated immigrants is marginal, their motives are the same...

MJMcCready
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Re: Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

Post by MJMcCready » Fri May 31, 2019 2:32 pm

Turn up. Take their money. Bugger off elsewhere. Take their money instead.

MJMcCready
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Re: Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

Post by MJMcCready » Fri May 31, 2019 2:37 pm

I lament that the only GMs that did this and went shagging behind their wife's back were Brits abroad. I bet you can guess who was most guilty. The last one he coupled up with was a very pretty German woman, a top 1200 player, 1279. Long blonde hair and very petty. He was a low 2600 player way back then but was kind enough to escort her to her room for 'private sessions'. I bet, courtesy of his reputation and his somewhat defensive write up of that tournament, you can guess who it was. Brits abroad are just as bad, if not far worse than foreigners...I think I have said enough here.

Alistair Campbell
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Re: Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

Post by Alistair Campbell » Fri May 31, 2019 2:57 pm

Well, I had a good time.

It was a good day out, about an hour’s drive from Edinburgh, and slightly off the beaten track. Motorway closure meant a detour through darkest Fife, passing through Freuchie (of interest to the cricket enthusiast) and Auchtermuchty (ditto the accordionist).

Organisation was a little bit amateurish – I suspect the unprincipled could have blagged their way in without a ticket. Food was tasty if a little pricey; coffee was relatively cheap. (I couldn’t comment on the cost of the spirit).

To reiterate – the games were played upstairs in front of a specially selected group of “VIPs”. (Apparently Magnus claimed it was a little chilly the first day, so they allegedly turned on the heating of the stills for Sunday). Mere mortals had the option of watching the screen in the commentary room, or sitting in one of the other rooms where there was split-screen coverage with audio commentary. There were plenty of sets for those who fancied a casual game.

I thought Genna Sosonko was good value. I was interested in his opening remarks, when he argued that whereas some World Champions (Botvinnik I think was his example) were primus inter pares , others, such as Carlsen, were the best player by some distance. He chose not to comment on another common use of the phrase to describe the occupant of 10 Downing Street as merely one of a number of equally capable ministers. The commentators also chose to side-step the etymological root of the Scotch Gambit, wisely in my view.

Regarding the players – it was a top class line up IMO. The current world champion, the previous world champion, a WC contender, and world number 3 (not sure of Ding’s Rapid ranking) – probably the greatest display of chess talent in Fife since Tal and Spassky visited Glenrothes in 1988. There were plenty of (I guess) 2nd and 3rd generation Indians who were very excited to see Vishy.

As for the chess itself, I think that was largely immaterial – top quality chess and entertainment aren’t necessarily the same thing. Besides, as is common with many competitive recreations, you can often get a better view and commentary in the comfort of your own home (although Sosonko and King were good).

The prizes of casks (or kegs?) of spirit to be allowed to mature before being bottled (It needs to be 3 years and 1 day old to be called whisky) was a fun concept – whether the players would rather cold, hard cash I don’t know. I’d like to think they will appreciate the former in years to come. Where the money came from, I’ve no idea. Chess Scotland had only the most tangential involvement (and Geoff –little point in writing to your MP – it’s not a reserved matter so they’ll punt it to one of your eight MSPs. BTW wasn’t it £10k p.a.? (For head office expenses)).

The fascination with being in the presence of superstars is an intriguing phenomenon. It’s like being with royalty (I imagine) – they almost appear like normal humans…

I had one minor quibble – the screen in the commentary room could show either one or other position, or the video feed of one or other pair of players. There were occasions when we were left staring at the players whilst Sosonko and King were discussing and playing moves on a position we couldn’t see. Perhaps that could be ironed out if there were a next time.

But, as I said, I had a good time, and I think the players did as well.

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IM Jack Rudd
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Re: Carlsen, Anand and Ding Liren to play in the UK

Post by IM Jack Rudd » Fri May 31, 2019 3:00 pm

MJMcCready wrote:
Fri May 31, 2019 2:29 pm
Modern day Britain is such a free for all, the difference between professional chess players and uneducated immigrants is marginal, their motives are the same...
This particular professional chess player has a motive of "not wanting anti-immigrant hostility stoked on the forum". Feel free to go and enjoy the sunshine for the next day or so.

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