Coronavirus leading to cancellation?

[David Sedgwick]

Hastings Chess Club has closed with effect from today for the first time ever. It stayed open throughout both World Wars.

Sad and difficult times.

[Roger Lancaster]

I don't propose adding anything further to this thread [so don't expect a reply from me if you disagree with what follows] which has a lot of dubious comment but it's probably worth drawing peoples' attention to a piece just written by the BBC health correspondent which includes the following observation on comparative statistics.

"The figures for coronavirus are eye-watering. But what is not clear - because the modellers did not map this - is to what extent the deaths would have happened without coronavirus. Of course, this will never truly be known until the pandemic is over, which is why modelling is very difficult and needs caveats. But given that the old and frail are the most vulnerable, would these people be dying anyway?

"Every year more than 500,000 people die in England and Wales: factor in Scotland and Northern Ireland, and the figure tops 600,000.
The coronavirus deaths will not be on top of this. Many would be within this "normal" number of expected deaths. In short, they would have died anyway. It was a point conceded by Sir Patrick at a press conference on Thursday when he said there would be "some overlap" between coronavirus deaths and expected deaths - he just did not know how much of an overlap.

"In contrast, the figure he gave for flu deaths to MPs - 8,000 - is different. It is actually the number of deaths over and above what you would expect to happen in any given year. Many more die with flu, but the figure gives you an indication of how many more die because of flu, whereas the 20,000, 250,000 and 500,000 figures for coronavirus are simply the number of deaths linked to coronavirus. The testing which has been done in many countries means we know when a patient dies with the virus inside their body. What it does not tell us is to what extent coronavirus contributed to the death."

[JustinHorton]

You know that piece has already had to be re-titled and rewritten because of objections to it.

[Roger Lancaster]

You know that piece has already had to be re-titled and rewritten because of objections to it.

Really? See https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51979654

[Roger Lancaster]

You know that piece has already had to be re-titled and rewritten because of objections to it.

Really? See https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51979654

[Alan Walton]

You know that piece has already had to be re-titled and rewritten because of objections to it.

Sounds like censorship if it had been re-written because of objections, all views should be accepted; only if something is factually incorrect it should be removed

I remember listening to that question and answer around overlap, and it did seem to contradict the SAGE mortality assumption directly relating to the virus

[JustinHorton]

You know that piece has already had to be re-titled and rewritten because of objections to it.

Sounds like censorship if it had been re-written because of objections,

Oh don't be stupid man, it's a piece on the BBC.

It's a public service broadcaster in the middle of a crisis, not some random clown saying what they want.

Really? See https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51979654

Yes really, it first appeared yesterday evening with a much more provcative title.

[Roger Lancaster]

Yes really, it first appeared yesterday evening with a much more provcative title.

That may have been the case - I wasn't watching yesterday evening - but presumably we're agreed that what I've posted is reproduced from a currently-appearing longer article which others can access if they're interested in the background as perceived by the BBC journalist in question.

PS: I've already lingered on this thread longer than I anticipated so that's it from me.

[NickFaulks]

It's a public service broadcaster

Alternatively, it's a taxpayer funded organisation that has gone rogue and set itself up as a centre of opposition to the elected government.

[Matt Mackenzie]

You know that piece has already had to be re-titled and rewritten because of objections to it.

Sounds like censorship if it had been re-written because of objections,

Oh don't be stupid man, it's a piece on the BBC.

It's a public service broadcaster in the middle of a crisis, not some random clown saying what they want.

Talking of which, Brendan O'Neill's latest roasting hot take on this business is up......

[JustinHorton]

It's a public service broadcaster

Alternatively, it's a taxpayer funded organisation that has gone rogue and set itself up as a centre of opposition to the elected government.

Yeah whatever

[Matt Mackenzie]

It's a public service broadcaster

Alternatively, it's a taxpayer funded organisation that has gone rogue and set itself up as a centre of opposition to the elected government.

Yeah whatever

Alternatively, for the last few years it has been an almost totally cowed and craven pro-government state broadcaster - which is belatedly discovering *some* of its actual responsibilities as this crisis has developed. Of course, certain people won't like this......

[JustinHorton]

I'm no keener on a debate about the BBC today than I was on one about Brexit yesterday, but we can either have them writing pieces that seem to undermine the government's critics, or we can have them as a subversive organisation seeking to undermine the government.

[JustinHorton]

Still, at least some people are keeping their heads. Take, for instance, the Daily Mail. As it observes...

self-isolation and social distancing have (so quickly) become buzzwords, a ‘getaway’ in the UK has taken on new meaning

and

Yes, as ever, you get away from home — but now we are being advised to get away from other people, too

but

luckily, the UK has plenty of remote spots to do just that. Here we have highlighted just a few of the best places in which to revel in splendid isolation

"Splendid isolation" was Lord Salisbury, no? But let us not be distracted from the Mail's guide to the best remote spots in Britain for a few days' break to which you can travel if you fancy trying to infect the locals.

[JustinHorton]

(Meanwhile, back on planet Earth, people really might like to take ten minutes to listen to this doctor, to everything he says, but perhaps especially to what he says about how the people who are being treated now are people who were infected a fortnight ago. (There is a slightly longer version here.)