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An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2022 5:48 pm
by AlanLlewellyn
Here is a recent-near textbook exposition of an anti-Nimzo-Indian setup which is a definite part of the English opening and very aggressive, a gambit often occurs where White gambits his e5 pawn, black plays the opening to about 14 book moves-this is an introduction to the mikenas-flohr which has no flaws
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2022 5:52 pm
by AlanLlewellyn
i have a whole system related to the English Opening, anti-dutch, anti-kings indian you name it i play it. The mikenas-flohr is played after 1 c4 Nf6 2 Nc3 e6 3 e4 (note that 3 d4 is a transposition into the nimzo-indian and possibly what black hopes for) (also note that 4...Ng8 is the accepted book move to this line)
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2022 7:44 pm
by John Sellen
" black plays the opening to about 14 book moves "
The game above is from an online U 1300 tournament
Its not my experience that U 1300 players dish out 14 moves of theory
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2022 8:21 pm
by Roger de Coverly
John Sellen wrote: ↑Sat Jul 23, 2022 7:44 pm
Its not my experience that U 1300 players dish out 14 moves of theory
It's semi-forced and has been played by some famous names with both colours. I had to look it up, I've never even had the position after 1. c4 Nf6 2. Nc3 e6. Still I might have decided against 2. .. e6 on the grounds that "they've got that odd line with 3. e4 and you have to meet e5 with .. Ng8" ,
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2022 8:28 pm
by Joey Stewart
It looks like absolute garbage for black - who would ever willingly give up tempo with a knight retreat AND follow up with grabbing a hot pawn??. I always say the best thing to do against the English is to play the most boring drawing variations against it - white has no intention of taking any sort of risks in this opening so no point humouring them with an exciting game they will likely get the better of you in anyway.
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2022 9:40 pm
by AlanLlewellyn
Roger de Coverly wrote: ↑Sat Jul 23, 2022 8:21 pm
John Sellen wrote: ↑Sat Jul 23, 2022 7:44 pm
Its not my experience that U 1300 players dish out 14 moves of theory
It's semi-forced and has been played by some famous names with both colours. I had to look it up, I've never even had the position after 1. c4 Nf6 2. Nc3 e6. Still I might have decided against 2. .. e6 on the grounds that "they've got that odd line with 3. e4 and you have to meet e5 with .. Ng8" ,
not sure if its more common but Roger, another line is 1 c4 Nf6 2 Nc3 e6 3 e4 d5 meeting 4 e5?! with 4...Ne4 or 4...d4 or even 4...Ne7 is the french advanced variation
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2022 9:44 pm
by AlanLlewellyn
Joey Stewart wrote: ↑Sat Jul 23, 2022 8:28 pm
It looks like absolute garbage for black - who would ever willingly give up tempo with a knight retreat AND follow up with grabbing a hot pawn??. I always say the best thing to do against the English is to play the most boring drawing variations against it - white has no intention of taking any sort of risks in this opening so no point humouring them with an exciting game they will likely get the better of you in anyway.
there isnt a drawn line in my english repertoire
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2022 9:50 pm
by AlanLlewellyn
against the kings indian i play 1 c4 Nf6 2 Nc3 g6 3 e4 d6 4 f4 Bg7 5 Nf3 c5 6 Be2 Nc6 7 0-0 0-0 and i attack all out on the kingside with moves such as g4 and f5 with the centre closed its hard for black to cope
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2022 9:51 pm
by AlanLlewellyn
against the dutch i play something similar to against the kings indian
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2022 1:34 am
by AlanLlewellyn
John Sellen wrote: ↑Sat Jul 23, 2022 7:44 pm
" black plays the opening to about 14 book moves "
The game above is from an online U 1300 tournament
Its not my experience that U 1300 players dish out 14 moves of theory
for a start the average of the team is u1300, i am 1554 and my opponent was 1580 on the icc team 45 45 ratings and it is entirely similar to most of my games which go along a book line for atleast 10 maybe 20 moves playing 1500s and 1600s this is both online and otb i dont know what you are insinuating there.
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:14 pm
by John Sellen
" it is entirely similar to most of my games which go along a book line for atleast 10 maybe 20 moves playing 1500s and 1600s this is both online and otb" "
Really ??
To go for 10 maybe 20 moves along a book line requires BOTH players to know the book line. This just doesnt happen at our level .
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:18 pm
by AlanLlewellyn
John Sellen wrote: ↑Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:14 pm
" it is entirely similar to most of my games which go along a book line for atleast 10 maybe 20 moves playing 1500s and 1600s this is both online and otb" "
Really ??
To go for 10 maybe 20 moves along a book line requires BOTH players to know the book line. This just doesnt happen at our level .
when i say book i mean livebook on chessbase as in all the moves ever played in different opening positions at the highest(and semi-pro) level not an actual physical book
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:24 pm
by AlanLlewellyn
livebook has 7million games in its book and about 100 million positions
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:28 pm
by Nick Ivell
The ...Ng8 retreat can't be that bad, as Karpov played it in his first match v Korchnoi, albeit in conjunction with a Q-side fianchetto, which I presume makes it better.
Who knows? I would back Karpov's positional judgement against anyone on this forum.
Re: An English Opening system called the Mikenas-Flohr Variation
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:33 pm
by AlanLlewellyn
Nick Ivell wrote: ↑Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:28 pm
The ...Ng8 retreat can't be that bad, as Karpov played it in his first match v Korchnoi, albeit in conjunction with a Q-side fianchetto, which I presume makes it better.
Who knows? I would back Karpov's positional judgement against anyone on this forum.
it looks terrible to a patzer and you can see why people who dont know the theory behind the line settle for 3...d6 after 3 e4 they do so very often