English Chess Forum

I was checking the collection of chess sets at the Colchester Chess Club and found re-felting need was almost entirely a black pawn thing. It could be just chemistry of colour and felt glue but there could be a deeper reason? Perhaps black moves pawns more? Perhaps the extra worry of playing black affects the moving hand? Has anyone else spotted this phenomenon? Is there an answer (on Twitter someone blamed Scandi players!)?

And a linked question - has anyone found a good supplier of replacement felts, I only manged to source supplies that were mainly too small or too big for a normal pawn?

Here's a couple of scientific explanations.

1) It could be down to the dyes they put in to make the plastic black giving the pieces a more 'slippery' surface and the glue does not adhere as well to them.

2) black surfaces absorb more heat so the pieces will be slightly warmer then the white ones and this may also account for the weakening of the glue.

But if they want to blame Scandinavian opening players then by all means go ahead - nobody likes those types!

David York wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 20, 2023 12:49 pm

Has anyone else spotted this phenomenon? Is there an answer

I do not know the answer but Murphy's Law dictates if you knock a pawn onto the floor in your house it will be a black pawn and it will have bounced into the darkest corner of the room.

David York wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 20, 2023 12:49 pm

And a linked question - has anyone found a good supplier of replacement felts, I only manged to source supplies that were mainly too small or too big for a normal pawn?

I just got some of this stuff: https://amzn.eu/d/h9Bcrsa. I've done about 75 pieces with maybe a fifth of a £5 sheet.

I find if you cut a square the same diameter as the piece, stick it on, and round off the four corners with a really good pair of sewing scissors, you can get a damn near perfect circle.

Geoff Chandler wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 20, 2023 6:56 pm

David York wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 20, 2023 12:49 pm

Has anyone else spotted this phenomenon? Is there an answer

I do not know the answer but Murphy's Law dictates if you knock a pawn onto the floor in your house it will be a black pawn and it will have bounced into the darkest corner of the room.

I can assure you that, if you play chess outdoors on a snowy day in December, Murphy's Law operates entirely differently.

More importantly, which do you prefer, plastic or wooden pieces? I prefer wooden. More weight to them, less likely to slip out of your hands during blitz.

Joey Stewart wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 20, 2023 1:29 pm

Here's a couple of scientific explanations.

1) It could be down to the dyes they put in to make the plastic black giving the pieces a more 'slippery' surface and the glue does not adhere as well to them.

2) black surfaces absorb more heat so the pieces will be slightly warmer then the white ones and this may also account for the weakening of the glue.

But if they want to blame Scandinavian opening players then by all means go ahead - nobody likes those types!

In the days of wooden sets at school chess clubs the knights were glued on a spike to their circular base. It was mainly the black knights which got detached from their base with the inevitably rough treatment.

MJMcCready wrote: ↑

Tue Feb 21, 2023 4:20 am

More importantly, which do you prefer, plastic or wooden pieces? I prefer wooden. More weight to them, less likely to slip out of your hands during blitz.

Plastic, weighted and with a matte finish. I find wooden pieces have too high a centre of gravity and wobble, and the whites are always a shade too dark.

"I find wooden pieces have too high a centre of gravity and wobble"

which is why the old ones had lead weights in the bases, but then the felt covering came off and you lost the weights...

I find plastic pieces to be cheap looking comparatively. Wooden board and pieces is best.

Joey Stewart wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 20, 2023 1:29 pm

Here's a couple of scientific explanations.

1) It could be down to the dyes they put in to make the plastic black giving the pieces a more 'slippery' surface and the glue does not adhere as well to them.

2) black surfaces absorb more heat so the pieces will be slightly warmer then the white ones and this may also account for the weakening of the glue.

But if they want to blame Scandinavian opening players then by all means go ahead - nobody likes those types!

The thermal explanation I had not thought about - scratches head and tries to remember his physics degree stuff. The pawns will be exactly the same temperature in the bag or box whether white or black (weighted or not) and indeed wood will be at the same temperature as plastic. Mind you if you don't look in the bag or box you can't let that particular cat out.

Once in play the heat inputs are mainly conduction (board and hand), convection in the air and radiant from lights/heat sources. The colour theoretically only affects the absorption of radiant heat but the distinctions break down so even if just finger tips touch a pawn the close hand is still radiating heat towards the pawn. I feel some thermal imaging experiment is needed here as I can't begin to guess the magnitude of the effects.

Thinking about a thermal explanation also brings up the issue of mass and surface area and is that a factor in pawns suffering more or is it the larger pieces press differently on their felts or move less? Perhaps picking a piece up and putting it down again has an effect compared to sliding a piece ('drag queen chess')? Pawns hang around for the endgame whereas bad bishops get exchanged?

Having nothing better to do (!) I did a bit of research on piece movement - the usual lazy way by Googling it - https://chess.stackexchange.com/questio ... statistics This is fascinating from 2012; it appears to rule out individual pawns moving more than other pieces but I Immediately I noticed a comment: '
Extremely cool results I overestimated the numbers, so glad I asked. My favourite fun-fact from this is that black tends to move his king and pawns, in the expense of the other pieces. Thanks! –
Ramon Snir

Jun 30, 2012 at 15:20'
The table in the post is this one
White piece moves
-----------------
P: 7.7708 total moves, .9714 per pawn
N: 5.1677 total moves, 2.5838 per knight
B: 4.6259 total moves, 2.3130 per bishop
R: 4.6985 total moves, 2.3493 per rook
Q: 3.5775
K: 3.1718

Black piece moves
-----------------
P: 7.7998 total moves, .9750 per pawn
N: 5.1576 total moves, 2.5788 per knight
B: 4.3511 total moves, 2.1756 per bishop
R: 4.5364 total moves, 2.2682 per rook
Q: 3.4869
K: 3.2875

Conclusion - I must research data mining in chess.

Chris Goodall wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:19 pm

David York wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 20, 2023 12:49 pm

And a linked question - has anyone found a good supplier of replacement felts, I only manged to source supplies that were mainly too small or too big for a normal pawn?

I just got some of this stuff: https://amzn.eu/d/h9Bcrsa. I've done about 75 pieces with maybe a fifth of a £5 sheet.

I find if you cut a square the same diameter as the piece, stick it on, and round off the four corners with a really good pair of sewing scissors, you can get a damn near perfect circle.

Thanks for the suggestion for felt. There was even a review photo showing a re-felted Lewis chess set knight. It looks a bit thicker than I used, but worth a try. I hate trying to cut rounds so I might now rush off and see if there is some craft machine or laser cutter I can play with instead of getting on with my chess.

David York wrote: ↑

Mon Mar 06, 2023 12:05 pm

It looks a bit thicker than I used, but worth a try. I hate trying to cut rounds

Me too, I got much better results when I was trimming already-stuck-on felt using the bottom of the piece as a guide. It is a bit thick, and produces a lush green carpet like you get on fancy wooden pieces. If you want it a little less obtrusive you can angle the scissors underneath the piece, and just try to keep the angle consistent all the way round. (Hold the scissors still and turn the piece.) What definitely not to do is hack at it pastry-style with a craft knife, because a knife sharp enough to cut through the glue will cut through the piece too.