English Chess Forum

Kevin Thurlow wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 17, 2023 9:06 am

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/fid ... 94457.html

Thanks, interesting. Does the article have a link to the FIDE announcement hiding somewhere? I can't find it.

I think I do need to see it because apparently, as a QC Councillor, I shall from next Monday have responsibility for ruling on which transgender applications may be accepted.

NickFaulks wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 17, 2023 10:03 am

Kevin Thurlow wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 17, 2023 9:06 am

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/fid ... 94457.html

Thanks, interesting. Does the article have a link to the FIDE announcement hiding somewhere? I can't find it.

I think I do need to see it because apparently, as a QC Councillor, I shall from next Monday have responsibility for ruling on which transgender applications may be accepted.

https://www.fide.com/news/2580?fbclid=I ... s1AvTnM-ac
"CM2-2023/45 To approve FIDE Policy on Transgender Chess Players Registration, effective from August 21, 2023."

https://doc.fide.com/docs/DOC/2FC2023/C ... 3DLfgwhrhI

It has attracted quite a lot of attention on Twitter, one example being: https://twitter.com/IglesiasYosha/statu ... 41/photo/1

NickFaulks wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 17, 2023 10:03 am

Thanks, interesting. Does the article have a link to the FIDE announcement hiding somewhere? I can't find it.

I think I do need to see it because apparently, as a QC Councillor, I shall from next Monday have responsibility for ruling on which transgender applications may be accepted.

https://doc.fide.com/docs/DOC/2FC2023/CM2_2023_45.pdf

It only seems to cover a player requesting a change of gender, but not what should happen if a gender change occurs without such a request, e.g. a woman transitions to a man, says nothing to FIDE or their national federation and tries to continue playing in women only events.

LawrenceCooper wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 17, 2023 10:21 am

NickFaulks wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 17, 2023 10:03 am

Kevin Thurlow wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 17, 2023 9:06 am

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/fid ... 94457.html

Thanks, interesting. Does the article have a link to the FIDE announcement hiding somewhere? I can't find it.

I think I do need to see it because apparently, as a QC Councillor, I shall from next Monday have responsibility for ruling on which transgender applications may be accepted.

https://www.fide.com/news/2580?fbclid=I ... s1AvTnM-ac
"CM2-2023/45 To approve FIDE Policy on Transgender Chess Players Registration, effective from August 21, 2023."

https://doc.fide.com/docs/DOC/2FC2023/C ... 3DLfgwhrhI

It has attracted quite a lot of attention on Twitter, one example being: https://twitter.com/IglesiasYosha/statu ... 41/photo/1

Nigel has now waded in with his thoughts on Facebook. I assume from his language "fanatism" and "rabid extremists" that the opinions expressed are his own and not on behalf of FIDE.

LawrenceCooper wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 17, 2023 12:16 pm

https://doc.fide.com/docs/DOC/2FC2023/C ... 3DLfgwhrhI

Thanks. I did see this in draft and, while agreeing entirely with the principle, pointed out parts which I thought would not fly. They are still there.

NickFaulks wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 17, 2023 3:08 pm

I did see this in draft

now reported in the Guardian
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/ ... akes-place

The headline is a little misleading as there's no prohibition on anyone (except computers) from entering Open events.

Roger de Coverly wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 17, 2023 11:17 pm

now reported in the Guardian
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/ ... akes-place

Also by the BBC. It's their No. 5 most read article at the moment.

Ian Thompson wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 18, 2023 12:09 am

Also by the BBC.

"Yosha Iglesias, a trans woman professional chess player with the FIDE rank of chess master, said the policy would lead to "unnecessary harm" for trans players and women."

An FM changed gender and was expecting to get the title of national women's champion but now apparently won't. This does at least answer those who have been saying don't worry, this will never be a significant issue.

I have never seen a convincing explanation of why having grown up as a boy is advantageous for a chess player. Just don't tell me it isn't.

NickFaulks wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 18, 2023 10:09 am

I have never seen a convincing explanation of why having grown up as a boy is advantageous for a chess player.

You would have to buy in to the concept of "brain hard-wired for chess".

But isn't the point really one of eligibility? If there's an insistence that there should be separate competitions, titles, reserved places in team competitions, special prize money etc., then there needs definition as to who is and isn't eligible.

Roger de Coverly wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 18, 2023 12:16 pm

But isn't the point really one of eligibility?

Here is the German chess federation point of view about eligibility to women competitions: if a person is legally recognized as a woman they are eligible for women chess competitions.
https://twitter.com/Schachbund/status/1 ... 90481?s=20

Roger de Coverly wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 18, 2023 12:16 pm

You would have to buy in to the concept of "brain hard-wired for chess".

No you absolutely wouldn't. That is the sort of nonsense that is causing much of the unpleasantness surrounding women's chess.

Paolo Casaschi wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 18, 2023 12:48 pm

(in Germany) if a person is legally recognized as a woman they are eligible for women chess competitions.

That puts up some sort of barrier. Otherwise why would it not be possible for a top 50 or 100 GM to declare that "he was a she", demand entry to the Women's World Cup on rating, do enough to qualify for the Women's Candidates and then compete for or win the Women's World Championship? Would that have been in the back of the mind of those at FIDE drafting the statement. By no means a pushover to do this but an outcome within the parameters of the respective ratings.

Roger de Coverly wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 18, 2023 5:13 pm

That puts up some sort of barrier.

Not really, where there is a policy of self identification.

Would that have been in the back of the mind of those at FIDE drafting the statement.

Certainly mine, but mostly FIDE has just been under siege from federations demanding an official policy. Other people are of course questioning why they would waste their time on this - you can't win!

Roger de Coverly wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 18, 2023 5:13 pm

Paolo Casaschi wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 18, 2023 12:48 pm

(in Germany) if a person is legally recognized as a woman they are eligible for women chess competitions.

That puts up some sort of barrier. Otherwise why would it not be possible for a top 50 or 100 GM to declare that "he was a she", demand entry to the Women's World Cup on rating, do enough to qualify for the Women's Candidates and then compete for or win the Women's World Championship? Would that have been in the back of the mind of those at FIDE drafting the statement. By no means a pushover to do this but an outcome within the parameters of the respective ratings.

Do you really think that anyone would go through a gender reassignment process in order to achieve the glory and the financial gains associated with the women chess world championship title? Really?
Even more surprising this concern coming from the same organisation that allows players to change nationality at will.