English Chess Forum

A Congress organiser in Wales has come up with an interpretation which although seemingly consistent with the FIDE Laws of Chess goes totally against long established practice.

Scoresheets although provided by the organiser are allowed to be retained by the players. When the organiser wants a copy of the game, the accepted practice is that the top copy is handed in with the result and signatures of both players, leaving the carbons in the hands of the players. Where only single scoresheets are supplied, or none at all in the case of rapidplay, a results slip or similar is used for result reporting.

This is what the FIDE Laws of Chess actually say

8.3 The scoresheets are the property of the organiser of the competition

They don't on the face of it give the player the right to a copy.

This is from Tim Spanton's blog
https://beauchess.blogspot.com/2025/02/duff-ed.html

at the conclusion of my game we were informed we could not keep the scoresheets - there were no carbons - as they were the "property of the congress."
Instead, it was suggested we take photos of the scoresheets (presumably with smartphones we should not have on our persons).

I've seen players use phone cameras to take copies of the opponent's scoresheet in league matches with 10 second increment where the plyaer had stopped scoring with under five minutes remaining.

I'd be willing to pay an extra 5p on the entry fee for carbonated scoresheets

Roger de Coverly wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 12:30 pm

This is from Tim Spanton's blog
https://beauchess.blogspot.com/2025/02/duff-ed.html

at the conclusion of my game we were informed we could not keep the scoresheets - there were no carbons - as they were the "property of the congress."
Instead, it was suggested we take photos of the scoresheets (presumably with smartphones we should not have on our persons).

I've seen players use phone cameras to take copies of the opponent's scoresheet in league matches with 10 second increment where the plyaer had stopped scoring with under five minutes remaining.

If I'd been in Tim's situation, I wouldn't have had my phone with me, so taking a photo would not have been an option. I would have asked the organisers for a blank scoresheet so I could make a copy for myself. I'm surprised Tim didn't do this, or mention it in his blog if he did.

That blog post seems to have been removed, so maybe the organisers have had a change of heart.

Ian Thompson wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 12:51 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 12:30 pm

This is from Tim Spanton's blog
https://beauchess.blogspot.com/2025/02/duff-ed.html

at the conclusion of my game we were informed we could not keep the scoresheets - there were no carbons - as they were the "property of the congress."
Instead, it was suggested we take photos of the scoresheets (presumably with smartphones we should not have on our persons).

I've seen players use phone cameras to take copies of the opponent's scoresheet in league matches with 10 second increment where the plyaer had stopped scoring with under five minutes remaining.

If I'd been in Tim's situation, I wouldn't have had my phone with me, so taking a photo would not have been an option. I would have asked the organisers for a blank scoresheet so I could make a copy for myself. I'm surprised Tim didn't do this, or mention it in his blog if he did.

It never occurred to me to ask for a blank scoresheet. However, apart from the distraction issue to other players, I had lost quickly and horribly, albeit to an FM, and the last thing I would have wanted to do was to stay at the board and copy out such a disaster.

Sveshnikov held the unusual opinion that players should have the right to keep the scoresheets of their games rather than handing them over to organizers. He believed that players should have the right to decide themselves what to do with them (e.g. write a book with exclusive game scores), and not give future opponents unnecessary advantages.

MJMcCready wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 3:58 pm

Sveshnikov held the unusual opinion that players should have the right to keep the scoresheets of their games rather than handing them over to organizers. He believed that players should have the right to decide themselves what to do with them (e.g. write a book with exclusive game scores), and not give future opponents unnecessary advantages.

I have a friend who tries to only play in tournaments where the chances of games being published are v low.

Tim Spanton wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 3:25 pm

It never occurred to me to ask for a blank scoresheet. However, apart from the distraction issue to other players, ... the last thing I would have wanted to do was to stay at the board....

No need to stay at the board. You could do it anywhere in the playing area, or elsewhere if the organisers trusted you not to run off with their scoresheet.

Tim Spanton wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 3:25 pm

I had lost quickly and horribly, albeit to an FM, and the last thing I would have wanted to do was to stay at the board and copy out such a disaster.

I thought the advice was to study your losses so you learn from them and don't make the same mistakes again, although that's not the easiest thing to do after a really bad loss.

MJMcCready wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 3:58 pm

Sveshnikov held the unusual opinion that players should have the right to keep the scoresheets of their games rather than handing them over to organizers. He believed that players should have the right to decide themselves what to do with them (e.g. write a book with exclusive game scores), and not give future opponents unnecessary advantages.

Is this comment an incredible coincidence or blatant plagiarism?

Ian Thompson wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 12:51 pm

I would have asked the organisers for a blank scoresheet so I could make a copy for myself.

But wouldn't they own the blank one too?

Carbons could be troublesome if it's a long game and you have to use the back of the sheet to continue scoring. I never myself forgot to turn over both sheets, but I'm sure it's happened.

John Clarke wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 11:18 pm

Ian Thompson wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 12:51 pm

I would have asked the organisers for a blank scoresheet so I could make a copy for myself.

But wouldn't they own the blank one too?

Yes, just like they own the carbon copy when using that type of scoresheet.

Ian Thompson wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 09, 2025 12:10 am

John Clarke wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 11:18 pm

Ian Thompson wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 12:51 pm

I would have asked the organisers for a blank scoresheet so I could make a copy for myself.

But wouldn't they own the blank one too?

Yes, just like they own the carbon copy when using that type of scoresheet.

Perhaps it will become necessary for players to smuggle their own scoresheets into tournaments, or could using them fall foul of Fide's rule against note-taking?

Tim Spanton wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 09, 2025 11:42 am

Ian Thompson wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 09, 2025 12:10 am

John Clarke wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 08, 2025 11:18 pm

But wouldn't they own the blank one too?

Yes, just like they own the carbon copy when using that type of scoresheet.

Perhaps it will become necessary for players to smuggle their own scoresheets into tournaments, or could using them fall foul of Fide's rule against note-taking?

I don't think I'm going to worry too much about this happening frequently. If I wanted to concern myself with the provision of scoresheets I'd start with the organisers of rapidplay tournaments who don't provide scoresheets because there's no requirement to record the game, but also don't make them available to players who do wish to keep score.