English Chess Forum

So here is one that I am sure would cause trouble - what happens if a spectator points out a game winning combination whilst the game is in progress? Is the combination allowed to be played now or could the opponent on the recieving end of it now claim that it counts as an assist and be able to claim a win? I can even imagine a situation where a friend of the losing player deliberately pointed out a win for his opponent so that he could then have a get out clause.

What do you think? Is that the worst thing you can think a spectator could do or does anybody have any stories of even greater levels of mischief?

In a school game once I had a spectator (team-mate) who pointed out that my opponent's flag had fallen, which I hadn't noticed. My opponent protested to the 'arbiter' (teacher running the schools league, who probably wasn't much better versed in the intricacies of tournament regulations than we were); I offered to play on without claiming the win on time, since I was winning on the board anyway. After a bit of discussion I was eventually awarded the win - the fact that it was his first competitive game and he didn't know he was doing anything wrong was probably taken as a mitigating factor, I doubt an arbiter at a senior level tournament would be that lenient. As you say, if intervening in a game were to result in an automatic loss for the player 'benefiting' from the intervention, there would have been nothing to stop, say, one of my opponent's team-mates pointing out that his flag had fallen in order to get him awarded the point.

I can think of plenty of worse things that a spectator could potentially do (knock all the pieces over, puke on the board etc.) but none that I've actually seen happen.

Michael Jones wrote:I can think of plenty of worse things that a spectator could potentially do (knock all the pieces over, puke on the board etc.) but none that I've actually seen happen.

Having a spectator fall down dead (or just fall ill, to be less shocking) is quite distracting. There are several documented cases of players dying at the chess board (heart attacks in the stress of a time scramble, I think). Not sure who wins in those cases. Usually, people have other things to think of than a chess game at that point.

Unless it is deliberate assistance (ie the player has actively sought the involvement of the spectator) then no action should be taken against the player concerned. Whilst there is no doubt they have gained an advantage through the involvement of the spectator they (the player) cannot be held liable for 'things' outside their control. Without the spectator's intervention the player may well have gone on to see the combination/flag fall - assumptions that they wouldn't should not be made.

If it was a league match, and it was a team-mate that commented, then I may suggest some form of action on an internal club/league basis however the individual game should continue as previously and the result should stand.

Christopher Kreuzer wrote: There are several documented cases of players dying at the chess board.

One happened just last season in a Dudley League match.

Peter Ackley wrote:Unless it is deliberate assistance (ie the player has actively sought the involvement of the spectator) then no action should be taken against the player concerned. Whilst there is no doubt they have gained an advantage through the involvement of the spectator they (the player) cannot be held liable for 'things' outside their control. Without the spectator's intervention the player may well have gone on to see the combination/flag fall - assumptions that they wouldn't should not be made.

If it was a league match, and it was a team-mate that commented, then I may suggest some form of action on an internal club/league basis however the individual game should continue as previously and the result should stand.

The other thing that would surely happen: The spectator would be ejected.

Once when I was playing for Hackney against Islington I played a particularly impressive piece sac and the dozen or so spectators showered the board with gold sovereigns. Both myself and my opponent found this very off-putting and I actually walked into a back rank mate a few moves later, upon which most of the people watching took their coins back and wandered off.

Jon, gold sovereigns in Hackney? Dont think so.

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:Having a spectator fall down dead (or just fall ill, to be less shocking) is quite distracting. There are several documented cases of players dying at the chess board (heart attacks in the stress of a time scramble, I think). Not sure who wins in those cases. Usually, people have other things to think of than a chess game at that point.

Anyone else remember a year or so ago when Tkachiev turned up to a game drunk and fell asleep at the board? If I recall correctly Nigel Short insisted that any player doing so should not be woken since that would constitute outside interference in the game, until a lot of people pointed out that for all the opponent, arbiter or anyone else knew such a player could be seriously ill rather than just tired/drunk, and his/her health would be rather more important than sticking rigidly to the laws of chess.

Tkachiev........ LEGEND

Once upon a time (40-50 years ago, I think) the opponent of a Guildford player died in a Surrey league game. The game was adjudicated as drawn. Although the same outcome would still be possible today (as the Surrey League still has adjudications as one option for finishing the game) I expect a win on time would be the more likely outcome.

Ben Purton wrote:Tkachiev........ LEGEND

Not sure he should be complimented on that particular incident, so is there any chance of keeping to the point of this thread as I can see it might be one that wanders off track

Carl Hibbard wrote:

Ben Purton wrote:Tkachiev........ LEGEND

Not sure he should be complimented on that particular incident, so is there any chance of keeping to the point of this thread as I can see it might be one that wanders off track

Or even complimented...

Alex Holowczak wrote:

Carl Hibbard wrote:

Ben Purton wrote:Tkachiev........ LEGEND

Not sure he should be complimented on that particular incident, so is there any chance of keeping to the point of this thread as I can see it might be one that wanders off track

Or even complimented...

Or even complemented

Carl Hibbard wrote:

Alex Holowczak wrote: Or even complimented...

Or even complemented

Nope, definitely complimented!

I might need to moderate myself now