Media comments on chess

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NickFaulks
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by NickFaulks » Fri Nov 11, 2016 1:44 pm

Jonathan Bryant wrote: Regarding this match, let’s say Karjakin’s ethical code allowed public support of Putin’s fascist dictatorship but not accepting stolen opening preparation help
Defining anyone whose political views differ from your own as a likely chess cheat is just pathetic.

Jonathan Bryant
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Jonathan Bryant » Fri Nov 11, 2016 1:52 pm

NickFaulks wrote: Defining anyone whose political views differ from your own as a likely chess cheat is just pathetic.
Indeed. But not quite as much so as misrepresenting what somebody wrote.

NickFaulks
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by NickFaulks » Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:01 pm

Jonathan Bryant wrote: Indeed. But not quite as much so as misrepresenting what somebody wrote.
When you say it is "entirely possible" that Karjakin is an honest player, that suggests to me that you also think it entirely possible that he is not. If that was not your meaning, then I retract my remark.

Stewart Reuben
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Stewart Reuben » Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:40 pm

Ray said later that they begged Viktor not to play that line in game 32. He did and the resullt was a loss.
Of course history is full, in many sports, of a player making a recovery to reach equality and then blowing it in the next game. This is quite common in golf and tennis.

Jonathan Bryant
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Jonathan Bryant » Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:47 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Jonathan Bryant wrote: Indeed. But not quite as much so as misrepresenting what somebody wrote.
When you say it is "entirely possible" that Karjakin is an honest player, that suggests to me that you also think it entirely possible that he is not. If that was not your meaning, then I retract my remark.
It certainly wan’t. Given my zero knowledge of him I can only say it’s theoretically possible he might be dishonest, but I’ve absolutely no reason at all to think he is. I could say the same about Magnus. The point of my post was merely to respond to Chris’ post and show that even an entirely honest player could benefit from illicit assistance.

Don’t know about Karjakin but I’m absolutely sure about Putin’s government. Should that regime care enough about the chess to care about the result of the match, I’m absolutely certain there are elements within it that would be prepared to use illicit and illegal means to get there.

Mick Norris
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Mick Norris » Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:59 pm

Jonathan Bryant wrote:
NickFaulks wrote:
Jonathan Bryant wrote: Indeed. But not quite as much so as misrepresenting what somebody wrote.
When you say it is "entirely possible" that Karjakin is an honest player, that suggests to me that you also think it entirely possible that he is not. If that was not your meaning, then I retract my remark.
It certainly wan’t. Given my zero knowledge of him I can only say it’s theoretically possible he might be dishonest, but I’ve absolutely no reason at all to think he is. I could say the same about Magnus. The point of my post was merely to respond to Chris’ post and show that even an entirely honest player could benefit from illicit assistance.

Don’t know about Karjakin but I’m absolutely sure about Putin’s government. Should that regime care enough about the chess to care about the result of the match, I’m absolutely certain there are elements within it that would be prepared to use illicit and illegal means to get there.
Putin has sent his press secretary to the match
Peskov
Any postings on here represent my personal views and should not be taken as representative of the Manchester Chess Federation www.manchesterchess.co.uk

Jonathan Bryant
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Jonathan Bryant » Fri Nov 11, 2016 4:35 pm

Stewart Reuben wrote:Ray said later ...
As we all know - thanks to Michael Stean’s mum - Ray said before that he wouldn’t write a book on the match whilst working as Viktor’s second (he signed a contract to that effect) and then went ahead and wrote it anyway. You can understand why Viktor felt betrayed when he was betrayed.

Needless to say, that doesn’t mean Ray did actually send the opening move to the Russian’s as Korchnoi believed. FWIW I feel it all rather unlikely. Nevertheless,i is a shame that chess journalists at the time did feel the matter was worth investigating or reporting. Unfortunately, as Stewart has demonstrated rather well in this tread, there are many people who find themselves looking the other way where Ray is concerned.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Roger de Coverly » Fri Nov 11, 2016 4:45 pm

Jonathan Bryant wrote:
Korchnoi notoriously accused Ray Keene of selling his intended opening prior to game 32 of the 1978 match when the score stood 5-5 with the winner being first to 6 points, draws not counting.
It was a line of the Pirc that goes


Korchnoi had previous for using the openings of his English seconds, so the choice of the Pirc may not have been a surprise given the amount that Keene had written about it.

Checking a database, it had been played twenty years earlier in a Soviet game between Taimanov and Polugaevesky which even featured Karpov's seventh move. In the Bagio game Karpov eventually broke the centre by playing e5, as did Taimanov.

Jonathan Bryant
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Jonathan Bryant » Fri Nov 11, 2016 5:38 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote: Korchnoi had previous for using the openings of his English seconds, so the choice of the Pirc may not have been a surprise given the amount that Keene had written about it.
Quite. Also that he played it earlier in the match. Albeit a mainline Pirc and now with the early ... c5 like here.

As I recall theory at the time suggested 8 dxc5 was the critical test and thought to be clearly better for White. I guess they had a plan for that but Karpov went 8 d5 instantly leading to Korchnoi feeling he had prior knowledge of the intention.

I’m not sure if Ray had much if any history playing 6 ... c5 rather than ... Bg4, btw.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Roger de Coverly » Fri Nov 11, 2016 5:51 pm

Jonathan Bryant wrote:
As I recall theory at the time suggested 8 dxc5 was the critical test and thought to be clearly better for White.
That may well have been theory as written by authors well below the standard of Karpov. Had they done a database search in 1978, they may have found 12 games with 7. dxc5 featuring in 4 and 7. d5 featuring in 5.
There was rumoured to be a card index somewhere in Moscow containing the opening moves of all known games, so Karpov and his team could well have developed their own approach, independent of anything in works by Western authors. Apart from the marginal shock of being forced into a semi Benoni style position, the rest of the games looks entirely Korchnoi's responsibility.

Jonathan Bryant
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Jonathan Bryant » Fri Nov 11, 2016 5:55 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote: ... the rest of the games looks entirely Korchnoi's responsibility.
Oh indeed. And 8 d5 looks like a pretty natural move to my non-championship level eyes anyway.

Stewart Reuben
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Stewart Reuben » Sun Nov 13, 2016 1:43 am

Saturday's Times page 41 of the News Section
tells us of SLIDE MARTINS age 61 who sits on the Cambridge Uniersity Street challenging passers-by to chess. He plays in exchange for a donation. Thus he is not begging. He has two dogs called 'Check' and 'Mate'. He has being doing so in Cambridge for 4 years. He makes enough to buy 5 cans of super-strength cider a day. He has been on the streets for 35 years.
Later in the day of the interview when he was photographed, he faced Bram van der Veiden, a university player and lost.
Slide Martins is said to be a former junior chess champion. Does anybody know the name?
Bram is Dutch, rated 2170 and a CM.

Ian Thompson
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Ian Thompson » Sun Nov 13, 2016 2:17 am

Stewart Reuben wrote:Slide Martins is said to be a former junior chess champion. Does anybody know the name?
Real name Brian Glide, according to a Google search.

Mike Truran
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Mike Truran » Sun Nov 13, 2016 7:41 pm

For coach Wayne Bennett, there were some real thought-provoking moments in the game. The question remains how England unlock the southern hemisphere teams.

Former Great Britain coach Brian Noble on BBC One:

There is room for improvement for England. You have to move pieces forward, you might get beaten initially in a game of chess but you hope it starts a winning game.

Hopefully, coach Wayne Bennett's principles of the 'smarts' and the things he has spoken about come to fruition. He clearly said he needs time with the players.

Lewis Martin
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Lewis Martin » Sun Nov 13, 2016 10:25 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2016/ ... ddie-jones

Another one from Rugby: "They play the game like a physical game of chess, like chess with steroids" according to Eddie Jones.

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