Media comments on chess

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Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Sat Dec 15, 2018 4:43 pm

Yesterday's "Have I Got News For You" featured a definition of Zugzwang.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by JustinHorton » Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:59 pm

Geoff Chandler wrote:
Thu Dec 13, 2018 1:25 am
I see 'stalemate' has been misused again. You cannot have an ongoing stalemate. Stalemate means the game is over.
In some ways I agree with this, but I think "stalemate" has been around in ordinary (i.e.non-specialist) English discourse for long enough that it is not bound by its meaning in chess.
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

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Geoff Chandler
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Geoff Chandler » Sun Dec 16, 2018 3:40 am

Hi Justin,

We want our 'Stalemate' back.

They can use 'Dealocked' which leaves room for one side to come up with a compromise or back down.

And what happens if, as some want, Stalemate to be a win or loss instead of a draw.
Us chess players will think a deadlocked debate has been won by one side and we be all confused.

Tim Spanton
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Tim Spanton » Wed Dec 19, 2018 3:20 pm

The latest Private Eye's Dumb Britain section quotes the following exchange from an ITV show called The Chase -
Walsh: The Budapest Gambit is an opening in which board game?
Contestant: Monopoly.

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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Geoff Chandler » Fri Dec 21, 2018 1:47 pm

Yesterday on 'Fifteen to One' a contestant was told a question mark signifies a bad move in chess notation,
he was then asked what signifies a good move. The answer given (an admitted guess) was an asterisk.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by JustinHorton » Fri Dec 21, 2018 2:23 pm

Now if I'd been asked that when I was on, I might not have been the first one to sit down.
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

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Simon Brown
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Simon Brown » Sun Dec 23, 2018 4:00 pm

Times Jumbo yesterday, 36 ac; “Game: Nazis against Communist (5)

Keith Arkell
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Keith Arkell » Mon Dec 24, 2018 3:33 am

Stewart Reuben wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:55 am
Keith. This is a genuine inquiry,
When you reach R+B v R again, is there any interest in it for you? Is it not like K + Q v K in blitz for me? The only interest is in whether I will get to mate before my flag falls.
Now K + Q + N v K + R + B + N would interest all of us. Yet it takes more than 200 moves to win the exchange with best play on both sides. Both sides may legitimately be playing for a win. Yet the spoilsports would step in. declaring the game drawn after only 75 moves.
I'd forgotten about these posts!

Hi Stewart, my only concern is about trying to extract the full point from what is, more often than not, a theoretically drawn position. Occasionally I've entered the ending in a position which is already not only wining, but winning trivially. Very often I'm not sure when I'm winning and when I'm drawing, with best play. Johh Nunn annotated one I had v Colm Daly in the Dublin Zonal tournament of 1993 in which , due to inaccuracies by both of us, the assessment fluctuated between a win and a draw several times!

The ending is certainly not dull though. There are some extremely long and beautiful winning variations.
Geoff Chandler wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 3:25 pm

(Checked Keith's games from 1977 to 2018 cannot find a KRB v KR ending. He had a few with pawns but no pure KRB v KR.
mind you this is from chessgames.com, they may not have all his games. )

Hi Keith,

I ran that ending through chessgames.com to see how many you had...just curious to what your win/draw ratio was.

I added they probably do not have all your games. Obviously they don't. No slight intended.



Soz Geoff, you probably just caught me getting in the wrong side of bed, very late, and after a few beers. No slight taken :D

It is an odd quirk than none of them are on 'Chessgames', though. Having said that, less than 10% of my Classical games are on that site. It would be interesting to see how many are on megabases. I've slightly lost track lately, but think the total is now 25/25 ( all wins). This includes all games at all time controls, from 'official' competitions. At the time of the Streatham and Brixham interview the total was 17/17, so I've added another 8 in 9 years. None at all, in 2018, but 3 in 2017 ( from Paignton and the Midland Open, which should both be out there somewhere, and one v Mackle at a Plymouth Rapidplay).
Geoff Chandler wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 6:10 pm


I was hoping to find a few to store for a rainy day when someone messes one up and I could find a nigh identical position of Keith's to
say this is how it should be done OTB rather use TB analysis to show it was humanly possible given time constraints.

After the post went onto Britbase which I've always found helpful in the past, but no utility (that I could see)
of just grabbing Keith's games. Then recalled there were few of these endings in the last Olympiad. Found this.

So off I went to look at an Olympiad that I know had no increment. 1996. Which had two KRB+KR endings. (2018 had 9)
Thought I'd pitch in saying increments increases this risk of this ending. Then thought 'big deal.' where am I going with this?
What exactly is the 'risk' to chess in KRB+KR endings. All I could think of was endgame books eventually out-selling books
on openings and that will never happen. But perhaps some budding endgame author could use that stat to show this type
of ending is on the up (thanks to increments) and needs some study time. (I'll give it a miss - once in 48 years does not seem worth it).
I'll very likely write something about R+B v R in 'Arkell's Endings', to make up for not mentioning it at all in 'Arkell's Odyssey'!

In this book I don't trouble myself with objective assessments of what is going on, but instead, to the best of my ability, try to recreate my thoughts at the board - in words, when they were in words, and in variations when I was trying to analyse.
Last edited by Keith Arkell on Mon Dec 24, 2018 9:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Geoff Chandler
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Geoff Chandler » Mon Dec 24, 2018 9:03 pm

Hi Keith,

No problem, thought you had missed the gist of the post.

Was looking for something that is more common now in OTB games than it was 20 years before increments.

There might be more KRB v KR endgames but that can hardly be bad for the game. I was not sure what I was looking for but something
wrong is happening to chess and I'm blaming increments though I was coming around to use them after the first time control but not before.

Now I simply don't care anymore.

I gutted with the game after the London 'Classic'.

The only 'Classic' thing involved was the money. £236,000 divided amongst 4 players (£32,000 for coming last.)
They played 2 games of chess (surprise suprise all drawn) and them some cartoon chess.

I want players to make a good living. But this was ridiculous money inducing a serious
'them and us' situation that the struggling grass roots of the game cannot understand.

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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Keith Arkell » Mon Dec 24, 2018 10:19 pm

I hadn't really been following the thread, Geoff, but just jumped in.

It's a fascinating topic though, which extends far beyond whether increments are good or bad for the future of chess.

Essentially, what has been happening, since chess was thrust on us many centuries ago, is that humankind has been continuously deepening it's understanding of the game. Some people miss this point when they take offense on behalf of their heroes of the past, when we say ( and even demonstrate with the help of engines, and chess sites devoted to these sort of comparisons) that today's IMs play more accurately than yesterday's Elite players.

To continue to appreciate chess today, we have to learn to sublimate our enjoyment of Tal's brilliant sacrificial attacks, and instead enjoy the probings of one player to slightly damage his oppoment's pawn structure, in order to try to grind him down. Either that, or create an artificial environment, such as the reduced thinking time provided by rapidplay or blitz, so that accurate defence becomes more difficult, and the Tal type stuff becomes possible again.

When I wrote this article for 'Kingpin', 30 years ago, I had a sense we would end up where we are today, and, by the way, I love the gentle probings of modern chess.

http://www.kingpinchess.net/2014/03/kei ... -strategy/

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JustinHorton
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by JustinHorton » Wed Dec 26, 2018 4:29 pm

Guardian piece on Dvorkovich
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

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Stewart Reuben
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Stewart Reuben » Tue Jan 01, 2019 8:26 pm

I took part in a quiz this evening on the Boudicca, a cruise ship in The Fred Olsen Fleet, currently in The Seychelles.

One of the questions was : 'What is the name of the rating system used in chess'?
Of course the answer was Elo. I was known to at least one member of staff that this was a question to whch I would know the answer. Afterwards I explained to the quizmaster that Elo was a person's name, not an acronym. Sadly, we lost th play-off.

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:21 am

Watching John Williams (the guitarist) on YouTube last night (a fairly old recording), the TV person introducing him said that JW was a keen and good chess player.

NickFaulks
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Jan 02, 2019 11:42 pm


Stewart Reuben
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Re: Media comments on chess

Post by Stewart Reuben » Sat Jan 05, 2019 1:44 pm

Watching Sky News today about 1pm British time.
Mike ? talking of the confrontation between President Trump and the Democrats regarding the Government financil sut-down because the Democrats are refusing to support Trump's bid to build a wall beween Mexico and the US. Mike said something like, 'The argument is like a gint chess game'.
I imagine it will be repeated.

Written while on a cruise ship on its way to The Maldives.

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