KBN versus K

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David Robertson
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by David Robertson » Sat Apr 13, 2013 3:47 pm

Fair points. So really, solving the ending is a useful exercise, a training procedure 'external' to or independent of the practical likelihood of ever needing to perform the mate.

Paul McKeown
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by Paul McKeown » Sat Apr 13, 2013 3:48 pm

That seems about right.

Arshad Ali
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by Arshad Ali » Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:29 pm

James Toon wrote:The best explanation I found was in "100 Endgames You Must Know" by Jesus de la Villa. He uses the W technique rather than Triangles, but explains the procedure very clearly so that you understand the logic behind it. (There is more to it than the W technique, but it comes in at the most difficult point).
On pp.204-208 of his book. That's one good place. The other is pp.48-55 of Pandolfini's Endgame Workshop. Both treat the ending with respect and go into all the gritty details other writers glibly elide over.

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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:12 pm

Not sure if I could do this endgame in practice, but I would at least have a go.

Unlike a team-mate from a few years ago (who shall remain nameless) who offered his (higher rated) opponent a draw as soon as he reached it! :lol:
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)

Thomas Rendle
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by Thomas Rendle » Sun Apr 21, 2013 10:43 am

I had to do this for the first time in a live game yesterday at the British Blitz Championships. I was down to the +2sec a move increments at one point but I think I built it up to 10 or so before taking my opponent's final pawn.

It was a relief to me that I'd practised it many years ago but probably more importantly I sometimes teach it to others during coaching and that keeps the technique sharp. There's only one tricky moment when you have to remember what piece to move first using the 'W' method that previous posters have already mentioned.

1/5000 may be about right but it's important to know you can win the ending - coincidentally I was playing some practice 3,2 games on Friday and I reached B+N+P vs K+B but on that occasion I managed to promote the pawn.

Sadly as has also been pointed out there are more important things to study in chess... two of my next 3 games I simply placed a knight en prise!! :oops:

Reg Clucas
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by Reg Clucas » Mon May 06, 2013 9:11 pm

The women's World Champion Anna Ushenina today failed to win this ending against Olga Girya at the FIDE Grand Prix in Geneva.

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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Mon May 06, 2013 10:13 pm

Oh dear, that's fairly embarrassing :oops:
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)

Andrew Collins
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by Andrew Collins » Mon May 06, 2013 10:18 pm

somewhat surprising, I didn't watch it live, but I assume she was short of time, and therefore couldn't just sit and think about it? I would happily swap my ability to win this ending for her ability though! Looking through the moves it seems that after her opponent got to the 2nd 'wrong' corner, she in effect gave up trying to win, it looks that way anyhow!


Kevin Thurlow
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Tue May 07, 2013 8:13 am

And the opponent was enjoying it so much she didn't bother to claim the draw after 50 moves!

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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Tue May 07, 2013 12:22 pm

Andrew Collins wrote:somewhat surprising, I didn't watch it live, but I assume she was short of time, and therefore couldn't just sit and think about it? I would happily swap my ability to win this ending for her ability though!
Yes, but for a world champion (!) to fail to do it is surely a new level of <facepalm>
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)

Arshad Ali
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by Arshad Ali » Wed May 08, 2013 5:06 am

Andrew Collins wrote:somewhat surprising, I didn't watch it live, but I assume she was short of time, and therefore couldn't just sit and think about it?
If you have to think about it, you probably can't do it no matter how much time you have. The "hand" has to know how and where to move the pieces. It's like driving: if you have to think about what should be reflexive actions, you're going to crash your car.

She should have played 82.Ne2 and if 82.... Kf3 then 83.Be6 and if either 83....Kf2 or 83....Kg2 then 84.Bg4 in both cases. It's something you have to know.

Andrew Collins
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Re: KBN versus K

Post by Andrew Collins » Wed May 08, 2013 8:03 am

I was actually assuming that this was something she had looked at but perhaps a long time ago, I somehow doubt she has never looked at it. At the point when she doesn't play Ne2 if she has time to think and has looked at the technique before she should be able to find it. Like I said it is clear looking at the game that by the time her opponent escapes to the second wrong corner, she had given up on a real attempt to win, which suggests it is possible she has never looked at it or that she just couldn't remember the technique.


I assume she will study it now, imagine the embarrassment of failing to win a second time

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