Possession of (or by) Mobile Phones

[Roger de Coverly]

No, they require him at least to warn anyone who has brought their device into view that he was not supposed to do that, and should not do it again.

Not the most satisfactory of rules and if it is in your possession for the first round of a multi-round day, little you can do about it. You potentially want the device in clear sight, theft risk notwithstanding, so that it is obvious to all concerned that it isn't being taken to concealed areas and switched on. Even that it doesn't have a secret vibration code to signal moves.

[NickFaulks]

I agree with you that that is implied. It follows that making your suggested amendment would not help.

If the penalty for allowing an arbiter to see a cellphone ( and why would a player do that?) is to be warned not to let it happen again, is that so horrific?

I turn up to play a match after work, arrive five minutes before the game, and take my mobile phone out of my pocket to turn it off.

I have to be warned.

I learn from the experience, so the next time I turn my phone off well before I reach the venue.

During the game I take my handkerchief out of my pocket to blow my nose and the phone becomes visible.

I have to be warned.

Yes, that is pretty horrific.

Moreover, it's not only the British who think so, as I made clear in my previous post.

Perhaps our definitions of what is horrific differ.

In the first case, assuming you mean that you arrived five minutes after the starting time, you should probably explain to the arbiter that you are fiddling with your cellphone only to turn it off. He hardly needs to warn you not to do this again, since presumably it needs turning off only once.

In the second, from my ACC standpoint I really would prefer that your hands do not come into contact with your wireless device at any time during a game. If you are so careless ( or cussed ) as to cause this to happen under the nose of an arbiter, then yes, he should warn you that you have done something that you should not have done. If you regard this as the reincarnation of the Third Reich, too bad.

[David Gostelow]

Players could put them in a central location in the match room turned off in a small platic bag with name on . Or perhaps on each table somewhere. Most sports you have to change for , this is a small inconvenience

[David Sedgwick]

I am one of those who have submitted comments on the Anti-Cheating Committee Paper to the Committee itself and to other FIDE Commissions.

I'd like to quote my comments verbatim. (The emboldening is new for this thread.)

"As this area concerns more than one Committee and Commission, I am circulating my comments on this item more widely.

Even before the publication of the Committee's Paper, concerns had been expressed, notably at the Brussels workshop, that new Article 11.3 of the Laws was totally impractical as it stands.

In correspondence with my colleague Mike Truran of the 4NCL (National League for England), Yuri Garrett of the ACP suggested that as amateur footballers did not have mobile phones about their person during play, neither should amateur chess players.

This is a false analogy. In any sport where players change into special clothing during play, changing rooms and lockers are naturally provided. Such facilities exist at very few of the venues where chess is played.

Mr Garrett alternatively suggested that players could place their mobile phones on the table in front of them during play. As things stand, that would not comply with Article 11.3, but confirm a breach of it.

I would submit that urgent reconsideration is necessary, with prohibitions on the possession of a mobile phone and other proposals in the Committee's Paper only applying to a far more limited range of events. If a mobile phone is used or sounds during play, that is of course a different matter."

[David Sedgwick]

In the second, from my ACC standpoint I really would prefer that your hands do not come into contact with your wireless device at any time during a game. If you are so careless ( or cussed ) as to cause this to happen under the nose of an arbiter, then yes, he should warn you that you have done something that you should not have done. If you regard this as the reincarnation of the Third Reich, too bad.

So if I touch my mobile phone while taking my handkerchief out of my pocket, that makes me a potential cheat, does it?

All my life I've felt that nothing would ever cause me to give up playing chess. I may yet prove to have been wrong.

I'm genuinely surprised by your attitude. I never thought of you as a supporter or advocate of officious arbiting.

[NickFaulks]

So if I touch my mobile phone while taking my handkerchief out of my pocket, that makes me a potential cheat, does it?

Let's just say, it would be much better if you avoided doing it. "I was just reaching for my hanky, guv, and somehow this message appeared" is going to be a very popular defence.

[Mike Truran]

I've been holding off finalizing the 4NCL 2014/2015 season rules in the hope that some clarity on the subject may emerge.

It's starting to feel like it may be a long wait.

For what it's worth, here's what our rule 12.2 says at the moment:

12.2 The League shall be conducted according to the most recently published FIDE laws of chess. In particular, it should be noted that FIDE rules on mobile phones and other electronic means of communication will be applied without exception. The Chief Arbiter will not normally give permission for any player or spectator to bring any mobile phone or electronic communication device or computer into the playing hall. Players should also refrain from bringing baggage in to the playing hall.

[NickFaulks]

Players should also refrain from bringing baggage in to the playing hall.

How's that going to work?

[Mike Truran]

Not "going to work"; "has worked": (a) Car boots; (b) hotel bedrooms; (c) hotel baggage storage facilities.

"Has worked", because 4NCL playing venues tend not to be submerged in luggage during play.

But that's not really the main point at issue, which remains how mobile phones should be treated.

[Christopher Kreuzer]

Not "going to work"; "has worked": (a) Car boots; (b) hotel bedrooms; (c) hotel baggage storage facilities.

"Has worked", because 4NCL playing venues tend not to be submerged in luggage during play.

In my experience, those without cars who have checked out on the Sunday prior to play tend to have their baggage with them in the playing hall. Discreetly placed around the side of the room, normally (plus under the tables if the bags are small), but there are noticeable numbers of bags there. If you are sure the hotel storage facilities can cope with this, then fine, but it would be worth checking. Some people will insist on keeping some small bags with them (handbags and other items of apparel). At a recent tournament, where I was on holiday anyway, I carried passport and money and other items in a bum bag (secured around the waist with a strap). You will also get people who have bought chess books at the bookstall carrying them around in a bag. You will struggle to get all bags out of the playing area.

[Andrew Martin]

Can we just agree that there is no reason whatsoever that a chess player should have a mobile phone or any electronic device which can be used for communication on them in the tournament hall. Those found carrying such devices should be defaulted,

If people are so busy that they need to be contacted 24/7, then don't play on that particular day.

A firm stand is needed.

This does not stop accomplices handing such devices to a player en route from hall to WC. I do not know how this can be policed.

[NickFaulks]

Not "going to work"; "has worked": (a) Car boots; (b) hotel bedrooms; (c) hotel baggage storage facilities.

"Has worked", because 4NCL playing venues tend not to be submerged in luggage during play.

But that's not really the main point at issue, which remains how mobile phones should be treated.

I'm a couple of years out of date, because in my experience of 4NCL Sundays I have

a) had no car
b) checked out of my room, and
c) had no (inexpensive) access to storage

If these conditions are satisfied, there is no excuse for the cellphone not being in the baggage. I should be very suspicious of anyone who insisted upon have one on their person while playing their game ( and I can assure you that I am not one of the more hawkish voices on this subject).

[NickFaulks]

Can we just agree that there is no reason whatsoever that a chess player should have a mobile phone or any electronic device which can be used for communication on them in the tournament hall.

Clearly not, that is precisely what many here want to enshrine as a basic human right. Funnily enough,they tend to be the same people who berate FIDE for doing nothing about cheating.

[David Sedgwick]

Can we just agree that there is no reason whatsoever that a chess player should have a mobile phone or any electronic device which can be used for communication on them in the tournament hall.

Clearly not, that is precisely what many here want to enshrine as a basic human right. Funnily enough,they tend to be the same people who berate FIDE for doing nothing about cheating.

It depends entirely on the nature of the event. There's a major difference between a big international tournament such as the Tradewise Gibraltar Masters and an evening league match to which people may well have travelled straight from work and where there won't be facilities for them to store their mobiles.

As regards electronic cheating, I don't consider it to be a significant problem in the latter type of competition. Does anyone disagree?

[Roger de Coverly]

Can we just agree that there is no reason whatsoever that a chess player should have a mobile phone or any electronic device which can be used for communication on them in the tournament hall. Those found carrying such devices should be defaulted,

We can agree that such devices should be switched off before play commences and remain switched off during play. The problem isn't so much communication but devices that can run or potentially run chess software.

If people are so busy that they need to be contacted 24/7, then don't play on that particular day.

Again it isn't that they need to be contacted, and they cannot be if the device is switched off, but whether they are allowed to have such a switched off device in their possession.

A firm stand is needed.

There might be a case for closing down amateur evening chess leagues. If so, then banning the possession of such devices is a good start towards this objective since it probably rules out anyone travelling after work from taking part.