Biggest shock in England this year?

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Sun Dec 14, 2014 7:22 pm

What was the grade of the guy Hebden lost to in an early round of this year's LCC FIDE Open?

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Roger de Coverly » Sun Dec 14, 2014 7:33 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:What was the grade of the guy Hebden lost to in an early round of this year's LCC FIDE Open?
In round 2, he lost to Simon Roe, who is, or was 200 ish.

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Lee Bullock
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Lee Bullock » Sun Dec 14, 2014 9:20 pm

Hebden lost to a player with a slightly lower Fide in the last round today.
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Roger de Coverly
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Roger de Coverly » Mon Dec 15, 2014 12:08 am

Lee Bullock wrote:Hebden lost to a player with a slightly lower Fide in the last round today.

It was Richard Britton who is a contemporary of Hebden and an FM in his own right. He would have been a contender for an IM title in his youth. So not really that much of an upset.

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Lee Bullock
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Lee Bullock » Mon Dec 15, 2014 1:27 am

So you consider Britton a lot stronger than Roe?
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Roger de Coverly » Mon Dec 15, 2014 1:44 am

Lee Bullock wrote:So you consider Britton a lot stronger than Roe?
Their current respective FIDE ratings are Roe 2240 and Britton 2230.

Their ECF grades are Roe 196 and Britton 199

On current performance they are equivalent. I think Britton got closer to a potential IM title than Roe.

Steven DuCharme
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Steven DuCharme » Mon Dec 15, 2014 7:40 am

Kudos Mr.B :)
I float like a pawn island and sting like an ignored knight :mrgreen:

Francis Fields
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Francis Fields » Mon Dec 15, 2014 3:21 pm

Statistically, one shock does not mean anything. How many other shocks have you had?

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Jon Mahony
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Jon Mahony » Mon Dec 15, 2014 3:49 pm

Very nice game Lee, good logical, well thought out win that 8)

I don’t think Queen d7 looked that bad (then again I’m a 130 player too :wink:) I don’t think I’d have played it myself, but the point seems to be putting the Queen on a safer square before Bd6 is played, blocking it off. Does seem slightly passive though, I think I might have got on with a6 and b5 and waited for him to do something about the Queen on d5.

I’ve spoken to a lot of strong players, who all seem to have the same complaint, players of our level don’t play book moves but even if they know the moves are wrong, they still have to be analysed which drains time and flusters.

Robert Clegg, a strong player from Huddersfield is a perfect example. He quite frequently wins Majors, but when he had a grading blip last year, only won 1 of the Intermediates he entered (Leeds) the rest just sapped his grading further.
"When you see a good move, look for a better one!" - Lasker

MartinCarpenter
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by MartinCarpenter » Mon Dec 15, 2014 4:06 pm

Does look like a 'proper' win yes :)

The efficiency vs weaker players depends on the player! Some people at grade X are utterly ruthless vs those 10/20 pts below them, others much less so. Winning an inter/major means playing 30/40 pts above the field you face, so almost never a trivial achievement.

You can get the giant killing for the live Yorkshire grades here - http://www.chessnuts.org.uk/ny5/giant-killers.php . A health warning in that live grades with low weights are often incredibly unreliable. Still, unreliable or not, 92 isn't a bad mark ;)

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Jon Mahony
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Jon Mahony » Mon Dec 15, 2014 4:22 pm

MartinCarpenter wrote: The efficiency vs weaker players depends on the player! Some people at grade X are utterly ruthless vs those 10/20 pts below them
They all seem to be ruthless with me :cry:
"When you see a good move, look for a better one!" - Lasker

John McKenna

Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by John McKenna » Mon Dec 15, 2014 5:04 pm

Francis Fields wrote:Statistically, one shock does not mean anything. How many other shocks have you had?
Lee had a shocking start to his chess career -

http://www.ecforum.org.uk/viewtopic.php ... ely#p91765

And, I suspect he will deliver a few more if he continues to play games at a rate of knots.

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Lee Bullock
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Lee Bullock » Mon Dec 15, 2014 5:23 pm

John McKenna wrote:
Francis Fields wrote:Statistically, one shock does not mean anything. How many other shocks have you had?
Lee had a shocking start to his chess career -

http://www.ecforum.org.uk/viewtopic.php ... ely#p91765

And, I suspect he will deliver a few more if he continues to play games at a rate of knots.
Thanks John. Yes I have had plenty of shocks. Not as big as the one Monday or that draw v Sands when I was 79. Although I have beat the odd 150/160.

But I do play quite often to it increases my chances of causing shocks. But in saying that I very rarely play out of my grading section. But when I do play in higher sections and v much higher rated player I have a very good record v them.

I am the type of player who raises my game v higher rated and cant play my bets v players of similar grade or lower than me.

And Francis I am not to sure where I have said it actually means anything? My post here is just asking if it was the biggest shock this year in England. I would like to think it means I can get a much higher grade than my current 130. And still have a lot of improvement in me.

From 79 to 130 in 3 years for an adult is not too bad considering I have had a few periods of total inactivity in that time.
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2015 and 2016 Chess character of the year :)

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Mon Dec 15, 2014 5:44 pm

That sort of result does almost certainly show that you can improve from where you currently are. Probably by cutting out the poor results against those the same or lower graded than you. Getting to the stage where you can win comfortably against those below you, but can't work out how to beat those above you, will mean you have reached a certain stable level. Working out how to get past that and continue improving is not that easy.

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Lee Bullock
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Re: Biggest shock in England this year?

Post by Lee Bullock » Tue Dec 16, 2014 3:54 pm

Francis Fields wrote:Statistically, one shock does not mean anything. How many other shocks have you had?
Just for Francis thought I would enter Hampstead u2200 this week and show him some more shocks ;)

2013/2014 and 16/17 U140 Grand Prix Winner! ;)

2015 and 2016 Chess character of the year :)

Its not a failure to lose. Its a failure when you dont try and win.