Keene's claim to have won "22 national championship titles."

[Jon Mahony]

"the 80 programme series aired by Channel 4 on the Kasparov v Short 1993 world championship"

I remember them being interminable, but not that interminable.

I seem to remember RDK tunelessly humming the national anthem in the commentary box, when Nigel Short was about to promote a pawn - cringefest!

To be fair I don’t think anyone would deny that, in his day, RDK was a very good player - his love of flank and hyper modern openings meant quite a lot of draws, but he could hold his own with some of the best in the world - it’s just a shame he’s been holding his own ever since!

I think his claim to be one of the strongest players in the world, made years after his last competitive game, was pushing a little.

[Roger de Coverly]

I think his claim to be one of the strongest players in the world, made years after his last competitive game, was pushing a little.

The chessmetrics site ranks him at #56 in December 1970, one below Averbach and one above Walter Browne. I think he could be regarded as a top 100 player in that era, although there were no doubt many unknown Soviet players of equivalent strength not allowed to travel or take part in internationally rated events.

http://www.chessmetrics.com/cm/CM2/Play ... 0015910100

The ratings quoted are those internal to the site and are usually a hundred points or more above the historic FIDE ones.

Actual ratings can be found at http://www.olimpbase.org/Elo/summary.html

If you regard a qualifier for the World Championship as part of the Championship, then Ray played in a Zonal or two, without progressing beyond that stage.

[Jonathan Bryant]

I ... clearly no end to the man's talents

As Peter says this is old ground. Some of it amusing to revisit though.

E.g. forumites may remember that back in the 90s RDK got an awful lot of publicity for not solving a murder case but pretending that he did. It became known as the Black Queen Murder Mystery.

Anyhoo, he got rather carried away with himself in the aftermath, proposing that the Thatcher government should employ a "think-tank of grandmasters" that would tackle certain subjects like economics and crime.

And "countering terrorism".


If that’s not a call to send Ray to hunt down those guys in France I don’t know what is.

[Jon Mahony]

I think his claim to be one of the strongest players in the world, made years after his last competitive game, was pushing a little.

The chessmetrics site ranks him at #56 in December 1970, one below Averbach and one above Walter Browne. I think he could be regarded as a top 100 player in that era, although there were no doubt many unknown Soviet players of equivalent strength not allowed to travel or take part in internationally rated events.

Yes I certainly wouldn’t disagree chess metrics analysis - in 1970 he was at his peak (and talking of Walter Browne, Ray fizzled their Mastergame, game out in to a quite comfy draw, don’t know what their over all record was) and even later in his career he won the Lloyds Bank masters, something certainly not to be taken lightly.

However by the time he made the top player in the world claim in the early 90’s Chess had exploded and he quite frankly wasn’t even in the same class as the likes of Nigel Short or the other top British players, never mind some from the rest of the world.

I always got the impression that Chess to RDK was kind of a means to an end after a while. Achieving the GM title gave him the credibility to write books, get on telly and make money - something he did very liberally after he retired.

[JustinHorton]

What's the Global Chess Oscar?

(Frustratingly, the photo here is no longer apparently extant.)

[Roger de Coverly]

What's the Global Chess Oscar?

Without trawling through 60s, 70s and 80s magazines, the wiki description seems reliable.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess_Oscar

In which

The traditional voting procedure is to request hundreds of chess journalists from many countries to submit a list of the ten best players of the year.

It's likely the Chess Correspondent of The Times would be one of those invited to submit and vote.

Also for the FIDE perspective
http://www.fide.com/component/content/a ... hess-oscar

[Jonathan Bryant]

... in 1970 he was at his peak ....

No, his peak was much later. In 1970 Ray wasn’t a British Champion or an IM, let alone a GM.

[JustinHorton]

What's the Global Chess Oscar?

Without trawling through 60s, 70s and 80s magazines, the wiki description seems reliable.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess_Oscar

No it doesn't. That's the Chess Oscar. We're looking at the Global Chess Oscar, which I suspect is linked to the photo on display here and here, the second of which two pieces recounts:

The object was described by CHESS as ‘the “Chess Journalist of the Year” Oscar’, and the magazine’s extensive photo caption indicated that it did not for one moment take the award seriously.

[Jon Mahony]

... in 1970 he was at his peak ....

No, his peak was much later. In 1970 or an IM, let alone a GM.

Ah yes, not an IM until 72, I'd thought it was earlier.

[Kevin Thurlow]

"Anyhoo, he got rather carried away with himself in the aftermath, proposing that the Thatcher government should employ a "think-tank of grandmasters" that would tackle certain subjects like economics and crime.

And "countering terrorism"."

not a ridiculous idea though - Bletchley Park then GCHQ (and the former Inland Revenue) have actively recruited strong chess players over the years. You do need GMs who can do something other than play chess of course.

On the murder mystery though, I thought the diagram looked rather more like Lancashire than Ireland, but I am not a grandmaster.

[Jon Mahony]

not a ridiculous idea though - Bletchley Park then GCHQ (and the former Inland Revenue) have actively recruited strong chess players over the years. You do need GMs who can do something other than play chess of course.

Yes, but there is a big difference between Alan Turing & Co and RDK poncing about on a huge ego trip, pretending to be an intellectual and forwarding his bills from Simpsons to Westminster

[Jonathan Bryant]

not a ridiculous idea though - Bletchley Park then GCHQ (and the former Inland Revenue) have actively recruited strong chess players over the years. You do need GMs who can do something other than play chess of course.

Yes, but there is a big difference between Alan Turing & Co and RDK poncing about on a huge ego trip, pretending to be an intellectual and forwarding his bills from Simpsons to Westminster

Well quite. There’s an obvious difference between hiring chessers to do maths type stuff like code breaking and hiring them to think about solutions to social and economic problems.

There’s a good interview with Sarah Hurst on Kingpin http://www.kingpinchess.net/2015/01/sar ... questions/ which has a rather appropriate quote

I also came to the conclusion that chess brilliance has nothing to do with high intelligence in other areas, but tends to give top players a false idea of their own high intelligence. They equate their FIDE rating with their IQ.

[Jonathan Bryant]

On the murder mystery though, I thought the diagram looked rather more like Lancashire than Ireland, but I am not a grandmaster.

Bill Hartston came up with Venice, iirc. But he was taking the piss. And only an IM so not eligible for the think tank.

[Jon Mahony]

I also came to the conclusion that chess brilliance has nothing to do with high intelligence in other areas, but tends to give top players a false idea of their own high intelligence. They equate their FIDE rating with their IQ.

I would 100% agree with that - Chess players (I have to say, the higher up the grading ladder it goes, the worse it gets!) can be some of the most tactless, directionless and socially inept people in the world. I remember for my Saturday team, it was my job at one point, to meet our top board in the centre of Leeds and escort him to our home venue located about 5 miles outside town, because he was unable to recognise the correct bus to catch, or the stop he was supposed to get off at once there.

Coincidentally, as secretary of Leeds CC, I have just been contacted by the producer of an exciting new quiz show on the BBC, which from what I can gather features puzzles, crosswords and the like - he is eager to have a team of Chess players on.

I shall circulate the email, but I don’t imagine too many takers - I for one am abysmally bad at any sort of logic puzzle, took 3 attempts to scrape a high enough pass mark in maths to get into uni and half the time don’t understand the clue in the Times cross word, never mind the answer - in short it sounds like a recipe for humiliation on national TV

[Jonathan Bryant]

Chess players (I have to say, the higher up the grading ladder it goes, the worse it gets!) can be some of the most tactless, directionless and socially inept people in the world.

True or not, this is a different point.

She’s not saying top chessers are inept away from the board. Rather, that their ability at chess causes them to overestimate how ept they are when it comes to non-chess matters.