What would you pay for a title?

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Roger de Coverly
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What would you pay for a title?

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Feb 03, 2015 7:37 pm

FIDE seems to think that it can sell titles of "Arena Grand Master" for 50 Euros for the relatively low level achievement of a 2000 rating at Rapid, Blitz and Bullet on a server. You can be an "Arena Candidate Master" for 5 Euros and a rating of 1100.

Perhaps it can, but should the concept of a chess master really be devalued in this manner?

http://www.fide.com/fide/handbook.html? ... ew=article

NickFaulks
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by NickFaulks » Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:00 pm

I don't imagine that anyone will confuse these with real titles.

Jonathan Bryant
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by Jonathan Bryant » Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:02 pm

NickFaulks wrote:I don't imagine that anyone will confuse these with real titles.
Which means FIDE is officially peddling worthless baubles?

NickFaulks
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by NickFaulks » Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:31 pm

I wouldn't pay for one myself.

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Michael Farthing
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by Michael Farthing » Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:33 pm

NickFaulks wrote:I don't imagine that anyone will confuse these with real titles.
Disagreeing with you twice in the space of two minutes, I'm sorry to say that I think many people might. This could be used far away from the world of chess and with the international body endorsing it what better advertisement of prowess? Martin Luther would be nailing ultimata on to his church doors as we speak - and rightly so!
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Roger de Coverly
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:42 pm

Michael Farthing wrote: This could be used far away from the world of chess and with the international body endorsing it what better advertisement of prowess?
The press are always keen to label serious players of even modest abilities as chess masters, but they would regardless of titles.

Is it going to be in the world of chess training where even an (arena) candidate master will be seen as superior amongst parents or schools to someone without a title?

Niall Doran
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by Niall Doran » Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:44 pm

Wow! Fide isn't even pretending to make the effort of having titles that mean something.
An Arena GM title for having a 2000 rating? Candidate Master at 1100? It's a crass, money-grabbing exercise.
Maybe Fide got the idea from this 2009 article, which was pioneering in its vision of how Fide titles should be managed:

http://www.kingpinchess.net/2009/02/bur ... w-tun-nay/

Favourite quote from the interview: "It would be a lot easier if you could just buy titles over the Internet from the FIDE site."

NickFaulks
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by NickFaulks » Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:58 pm

Michael Farthing wrote:
NickFaulks wrote:I don't imagine that anyone will confuse these with real titles.
I'm sorry to say that I think many people might.
Yes, I was having second thoughts about that already. Anyway, there's nothing to be done. I don't really know who FIDE Online Arena are, but they seem to be exempt from all the usual controls. For instance, you might have expected these new titles to have been approved by the GA before they were made official.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:07 pm

NickFaulks wrote: For instance, you might have expected these new titles to have been approved by the GA before they were made official.
The FIDE Board is rather better than the ECF Board at recording its decisions.

In http://www.fide.com/component/content/a ... de-pb.html, we read
The Presidential Board reviewed the Presentation of the Online Arena in detail and approved the Online Arena Rating Regulations, Titles for the lower rating band and the new Regulations for the registration and licensing of players.

NickFaulks
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by NickFaulks » Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:42 pm

That's my point. The PB is specifically excluded from any role in the regulations for FIDE titles, and the federations must be consulted on all changes. Not these titles, apparently.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:46 pm

NickFaulks wrote: The PB is specifically excluded from any role in the regulations for FIDE titles, and the federations must be consulted on all changes. Not these titles, apparently.
Was this part of unfinished business from Tromso? But as for consulting Federations, the next election is nearly four years away, so I thought Kirsan and his cronies had a mandate to do more or less what they wanted for a few years.

David Robertson
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by David Robertson » Tue Feb 03, 2015 10:30 pm

What would I play for a title?

Correspondence Chess, of course. They dole out all manner of titles - GM, SIM, IM - to blokes you've barely heard of from the Pokington & District Div 3. Doubtless it impresses the neighbours, possibly the wives too - although I have hopes for the latter.

And the ECF? Didn't it used to award the title of Chess Maestro to anyone who could mist a mirror?

NickFaulks
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by NickFaulks » Tue Feb 03, 2015 11:34 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote: Was this part of unfinished business from Tromso? But as for consulting Federations, the next election is nearly four years away, so I thought Kirsan and his cronies had a mandate to do more or less what they wanted for a few years.
There was unfinished business in Tromso, but I'm not aware that this bit was even started. FOA asked to be booked into a QC meeting to make a presentation of their ideas, perhaps including these titles, but then didn't turn up.

As to your second comment, the PB most certainly does not have a mandate to interfere with the titles system. I do not expect them to do so. They evidently do not feel that these internet titles are worthy of that respect, and I can't say that I disagree.

David Blower
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by David Blower » Wed Feb 04, 2015 12:48 am

David Robertson wrote:
And the ECF? Didn't it used to award the title of Chess Maestro.
It still does. The link is here: http://www.englishchess.org.uk/membersh ... ts-system/

An ECF grade of 95 is needed (at any point in your life) which means I am a chess maestro (although I haven't bothered to pay the ECF the £10 so I guess I might not be a chess maestro officially. Nevertheless I have qualified via my grade to be one.)

In general I don't think titles should be brought, but earned. I consider myself to be a chess maestro as I have done everything (apart from pay the ECF £10 to earn it.) Nevertheless I don't actually use the title but if anyone asks me: "are you a titled chess player?" I can honestly answer: "yes" to the question.

Brian Towers
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Re: What would you pay for a title?

Post by Brian Towers » Wed Feb 04, 2015 8:10 am

NickFaulks wrote:I wouldn't pay for one myself.
But would RDK?

Ooops! Sorry, wrong thread.
Ah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now.

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