London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Discuss anything you like about chess related matters in this forum.
Nigel White
Posts: 85
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:22 pm

London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by Nigel White » Sun Sep 11, 2016 2:54 pm

Another apparent change to this December's London Chess Classic is that for the first time all the tournaments will be FIDE rated. In previous years the lowest category weekend (U120) and weekday (U135) events were just ECF graded.

An obvious impact is that all ENG players will need to be at least Gold ECF members. As a regular habitué of similar sections in many congresses, my casual observation is that most participants are not.

I was wondering what was the rationale for the change and what might be the effect on the number of entries.

User avatar
Michael Farthing
Posts: 1811
Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2014 1:28 pm
Location: Morecambe, Europe

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by Michael Farthing » Sun Sep 11, 2016 4:32 pm

There is a move to try and increase the reach of FIDE ratings and it is a move with which I sympathise. However, as you point out, there is a serious problem that this involves gold membership and the more successful such moves are the more silver membership would be squeezed out of existence.

The bronze/silver/gold structure is a sensible attempt at price discrimination to produce a system in which the greater your interest and commitment to the game, the greater amount you pay. But if a policy alters the boundaries it does call for a rethink of the membership structure. If you're listening Alex, please give it some thought! [Personally I'd probably go gold anyway except (shamefacedly) I do rather enjoy being a silver rep].

Roger de Coverly
Posts: 18102
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:51 pm

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by Roger de Coverly » Sun Sep 11, 2016 7:06 pm

Nigel White wrote: I was wondering what was the rationale for the change and what might be the effect on the number of entries.

It's now possible for a player registered or to be registered as ENG to play, at a price, without becoming a Gold member.

Michael Flatt
Posts: 1231
Joined: Tue Jul 02, 2013 7:36 am
Location: Hertfordshire

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by Michael Flatt » Sun Sep 11, 2016 7:40 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Nigel White wrote: I was wondering what was the rationale for the change and what might be the effect on the number of entries.
It's now possible for a player registered or to be registered as ENG to play, at a price, without becoming a Gold member.
The details are:
Chess Classic website[1] wrote:Rating and Grading
All tournaments will be submitted to the English Chess Federation (ECF) for grading, and FIDE for rating. It is a condition of playing in the London Chess Classic that the data submitted at the time of entry will be forwarded to the ECF and FIDE as required to enable the games played to be graded by the ECF, and rated by FIDE.

Obtaining a FIDE Identification Number
All entrants must have a FIDE Identification Number at the time of submitting their entry, unless they wish their FIDE nationality to be England. English players without a FIDE Identification Number will have one created at the time the rating files are submitted to FIDE. Please note: At the time of writing, changing this nationality later costs 250 Euros.
[1] Chess Classic Festival: http://www.londonchessclassic.com/festi ... events.htm

Alex Holowczak
Posts: 8910
Joined: Sat May 30, 2009 5:18 pm
Location: Oldbury, Worcestershire
Contact:

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by Alex Holowczak » Mon Sep 12, 2016 6:22 am

Last year in the Under 120 section, there were 82 entries. 33 now have FIDE-ratings and 52 have FIDE IDs. So the majority of the entries were already au fait with FIDE-rated chess. The numbers in the Under 135, which is now a Under 140 (mostly due to the conversion from a FIDE-rating then being a round number), have similar proportions. So I think it's worth FIDE-rating those sections, because by the time we get to the Classic, maybe as many as half of the players will be rated, so the chances of them playing games that could be sent for rating is very high. Certainly, I've ECF-graded tournaments with a lower percentage of graded players in the past!

Last year, entries were closed over a week early, and we were still over capacity on the first weekend. So I don't envisage there will be any noticeable impact on the number of entries.

Nigel White
Posts: 85
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:22 pm

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by Nigel White » Mon Sep 12, 2016 8:14 am

Thanks Alex for the helpful reply with statistics. However, I suspect most of those who have FIDE IDs but no ratings maybe ECF Silver members who have played in FIDE rated rapidplays (e.g. the previous two LCC Super Rapidplay Tournaments). If this is the case and the LCC remains the only UK tournament to FIDE rate the ECF U120 section, it may take a while for these players to achieve a FIDE standard rating. Still, I suppose you have to start somewhere.

User avatar
IM Jack Rudd
Posts: 3932
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2007 1:13 am
Location: Bideford

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by IM Jack Rudd » Mon Sep 12, 2016 11:42 am

It's already not the only UK tournament to FIDE rate the minor section - both Coulsdon and e2e4 have run tournaments that are FIDE-rated all the way down.

MJMcCready
Posts: 1234
Joined: Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:30 pm

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by MJMcCready » Mon Sep 12, 2016 12:46 pm

It's seems rather strange. The benefits being you have to pay more each year to have two ratings instead of one.

Andrew Zigmond
Posts: 1716
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:23 pm
Location: Harrogate

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Mon Sep 12, 2016 1:10 pm

The middle weekender at the British was FIDE rated for the first time and I had to upgrade to Gold in order to play.

The more upmarket weekenders may go FIDE rated all the way down, most won't. Upgrading to Gold costs £10, even if there wasn't pay to play. Last week following my club AGM I spent £7.20 on beer at the pub after.
Controller - Yorkshire League
Chairman - Harrogate Chess Club
All views expressed entirely my own

MJMcCready
Posts: 1234
Joined: Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:30 pm

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by MJMcCready » Mon Sep 12, 2016 1:14 pm

7.20 a pint? I haven't lived in the UK for 16 years, I hope that's not the average price of a pint these days. Last time I went to London (2009) I was asked to pay 5.50 a pint! Rip off Britain.

Andrew Zigmond
Posts: 1716
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:23 pm
Location: Harrogate

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Mon Sep 12, 2016 1:18 pm

MJMcCready wrote:7.20 a pint? I haven't lived in the UK for 16 years, I hope that's not the average price of a pint these days. Last time I went to London (2009) I was asked to pay 5.50 a pint! Rip off Britain.
Two pints at £3.60 each.
Controller - Yorkshire League
Chairman - Harrogate Chess Club
All views expressed entirely my own

MJMcCready
Posts: 1234
Joined: Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:30 pm

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by MJMcCready » Mon Sep 12, 2016 1:20 pm

Phew!

Alex Holowczak
Posts: 8910
Joined: Sat May 30, 2009 5:18 pm
Location: Oldbury, Worcestershire
Contact:

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by Alex Holowczak » Mon Sep 12, 2016 6:40 pm

As Jack says, there are already other tournaments that do this.

I thought of one other stat while I was wandering around the playing area today. How many players "played up" last year; i.e. entered the section above the one they could have entered because their grade was under 120? I can't ask that question directly without doing a one-for-one comparison, which I can't be bothered to do, but I can get close. There were 81 players in that section, and 15 of them would be eligible this year to play in the bottom section. 13 of those 15 have FIDE-ratings, and all of them have FIDE IDs.

John Garnett
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2014 6:39 pm

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by John Garnett » Mon Sep 12, 2016 6:48 pm

Is there any reason why the weekend tournament finishes as late as 8.30 on Sunday? I'd like to play in it but the need for an extra night's accommodation at London prices, and to take a day off work on the Monday, makes it rather less attractive.

Roger de Coverly
Posts: 18102
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:51 pm

Re: London Chess Classic - all tournaments to be FIDE rated

Post by Roger de Coverly » Mon Sep 12, 2016 7:03 pm

John Garnett wrote:Is there any reason why the weekend tournament finishes as late as 8.30 on Sunday? I
It's parallel to the round start times for the Classic Open whose round 4 would start at 4.30 pm. It's 90 30, so no guarantee of the finish time. By contrast, the weekend round 4 starts at a relatively relaxed 10.30 am.

Unlike the Classic Open, there is at least nominally a rating prize for those Under 2050 playing in the Open.

Post Reply