toughest mate in one puzzle

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Simon Brown
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Simon Brown » Fri Jan 27, 2017 9:14 am

Maybe I had another senior moment, but I looked at the first one for five minutes and couldn't see it. And still can't. However the second one took seconds - it's easy to see that there are no obvious moves, so the less obvious one jumped out quickly, for me anyway.

Roger Lancaster
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Roger Lancaster » Fri Jan 27, 2017 9:50 am

Re the first problem, the solution wasn't remotely the first move I considered. Modus operandi, after discounting the three N checks, was that the mate must come along a rank, file or diagonal. There are eight of those and I simply looked for one without a blocking reply. The a3-f8 diagonal stands out, when the solution becomes obvious.

Simon Brown
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Simon Brown » Fri Jan 27, 2017 10:40 am

Thanks Roger, I see it now!

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by soheil_hooshdaran » Fri Jan 27, 2017 1:28 pm

Joshua Gibbs wrote:Does anyone know a trickier mate in one than this?

https://www.chess.com/blog/Giorno/crazy ... -in-1-nr17
Ha!ha!
GM grivas gave this to us in Fide Traoners' Seminar!

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Joey Stewart
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Joey Stewart » Fri Jan 27, 2017 1:53 pm

I like the first one. I am finding the more I look at these "hard" mate in two (or one, in this case) the less I tend to consider the obvious natural moves as the positions are almost always massive zugzwangs which require a very irrelevant looking move to force the other side to move a defender.
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.

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Joshua Gibbs
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Joshua Gibbs » Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:06 pm

Joey Stewart wrote:I like the first one. I am finding the more I look at these "hard" mate in two (or one, in this case) the less I tend to consider the obvious natural moves as the positions are almost always massive zugzwangs which require a very irrelevant looking move to force the other side to move a defender.
post a mate in one yourself :)
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Barry Sandercock
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Barry Sandercock » Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:08 pm

Bh4 ++ ?

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Joshua Gibbs
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Joshua Gibbs » Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:11 pm

Barry Sandercock wrote:Bh4 ++ ?
KF8

edit: Queen g5
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Barry Sandercock
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Barry Sandercock » Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:20 pm

Also D8=Q ++

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Joshua Gibbs
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Joshua Gibbs » Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:23 pm

Barry Sandercock wrote:Also D8=Q ++
its pinned by the bishop on c8
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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:46 pm

Joshua Gibbs wrote:
Barry Sandercock wrote:Bh4 ++ ?
KF8

edit: Queen g5
Er, what? If Bh4+, then the Black response is Rg5. It is the move Bg5+ that is met by Kf8 and the move Qg5 by Black is never possible in response to a move by White in the position given.

It could be an interesting timed exercise to list all the other checks by White and the moves by which Black blocks or evades those checks. As Roger correctly pointed out, the easiest way to solve the mate in one is to look for the file or diagonal that can't be blocked. There are also several pawn promotions to consider.

EDIT: Oops. Missed that there are two Black queens, so in response to White playing Qg5+, the response by Black is indeed Qxg5, but the queen on c1, not the one on e5.

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:53 pm

Joey Stewart wrote:I like the first one. I am finding the more I look at these "hard" mate in two (or one, in this case) the less I tend to consider the obvious natural moves as the positions are almost always massive zugzwangs which require a very irrelevant looking move to force the other side to move a defender.
That is normally the aesthetic reason for such problems. It is the whole reason people compose them and have problem composing tournaments with specific aims to use certain motifs or certain (im)balances of material.

The first problem here (by Leonid Kubbel) was probably specifically intended to have as many checks as possible - there will probably be a name for the condition set. One challenge would be to have a similar mate in one with as many other checks that fail (attempted solutions that fail are called a 'try') but with all 16 major pieces on the board and no pawns (for example). That is probably impossible, but is an example of the sort of conditions that get set.

Geoff Chandler
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Geoff Chandler » Fri Jan 27, 2017 3:50 pm

Hi Nick,

"Nice, it was the last move I considered."

Well it will be wouldn't it. It's like finding something in the last place you looked. Why would you carrying on looking. :wink:

Regarding the wording of the 2nd puzzle. It was OK as it was.

If you cannot see the mate then you look for the only way it can be done.
An out of the box solution, what was the last move and ep.p's. are usually the candidates.
In some cases you have to spot it's an illegal position, retract the illegal move, make any legal move and mate.

"... and ep.p's. are usually the candidates."

I still chuckle even to this day after witnessing 5 years ago both players posting in the RHP forum
that something was wrong with the system as Black is in checkmate yet it has not been recognised.

Of course Black had mated with a double pawn move and taking e.p. was the only move to get out of mate
but both players had never encountered an e.p. capture before. There followed many attempts to tell the players
what was wrong without actually telling them the move because one is not allowed to comment on a game in play.

It got quite heated with one of the players boiling over in frustration and swearing at everyone.
Despite several warning from the site MOD somebody eventually cracked and explained the e.p. rule.
They were promptly rewarded with a two week forum ban.

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Joshua Gibbs
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Joshua Gibbs » Fri Jan 27, 2017 6:31 pm

Geoff Chandler wrote:Hi Nick,



Regarding the wording of the 2nd puzzle. It was OK as it was.
You tell them
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Nick Grey
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Re: toughest mate in one puzzle

Post by Nick Grey » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:22 pm

:D Joshua keep posting them - I have no idea how to, not techie enough to download - they are entertaining.

Perhaps my very old tactical training that double checks are usually very good & winning & then not looking for a better move because the clue was only one mate in one.

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