Council Papers are out

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
J T Melsom
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by J T Melsom » Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:51 am

David Sedgwick wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:02 am
J T Melsom wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:34 pm
Indeed David has previously admitted to not implementing a significant ''policy' in his life.
Can you give chapter and verse for that, please?
You have admitted in previous exchanges to having implemented relatively modest initiatives whilst spending much of your time defending the status quo in a manner similar to Canute. I don't have chapter and verse but I doubt my representation of your position is unfair, and is comfortably within the same parameters as the suggestion of a conspiracy to mislead Council.

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Michael Farthing
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by Michael Farthing » Tue Oct 08, 2019 10:15 am

J T Melsom wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:51 am
David Sedgwick wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:02 am
J T Melsom wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:34 pm
Indeed David has previously admitted to not implementing a significant ''policy' in his life.
Can you give chapter and verse for that, please?
You have admitted in previous exchanges to having implemented relatively modest initiatives whilst spending much of your time defending the status quo in a manner similar to Canute. I don't have chapter and verse but I doubt my representation of your position is unfair, and is comfortably within the same parameters as the suggestion of a conspiracy to mislead Council.
Well with spin like that you have missed your vocation. You should be in politics. I particularly like "relatively modest initiatives" becoming "not implementing a significant policy in his life".

J T Melsom
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by J T Melsom » Tue Oct 08, 2019 10:34 am

The internet is clogged up with toxic and intemperate debate often on trivial things. When intelligent people use words like 'conspiracy' all it really does is make them look silly, and gives succour to the trolls and less intelligent keyboard warriors.

Angus French
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by Angus French » Tue Oct 08, 2019 11:13 am

Well done to Carl and best wishes to him in his role. I support the creation of the Development Officer role though I'm afraid I'm skeptical about what results can be achieved.

Um, I do, though, have a couple of further questions:

1. Why has it taken almost a year to make an appointment? The creation and financing of the role was approved at last October's AGM. I understand there was some difficulty in obtaining finance from the Chess Trust and that took us up to April's Finance Meeting. But still...

2. What exactly is the remit of the Development Officer? My understanding, from the Challenges for English Chess paper (see p3 under 'Grow the Membership Base') was that it included increasing membership *above* the 500 new members a year the Board was already planning for. However, the announcement in October's newsletter referred to 'Driving forward the ECF’s plans for increasing its membership base by 500 or more per year' which reads to me as implementing the Board's original plan, not as encouraging extra memberships beyond the original plan. Also, what types of membership are we talking about - presumably not free memberships and ideally more youngish adult memberships in particular (to address "the demographic time bomb").

Perhaps Mike T or Julie might respond?

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Oct 08, 2019 11:32 am

Angus French wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 11:13 am
Also, what types of membership are we talking about - presumably not free memberships and ideally more youngish adult memberships in particular (to address "the demographic time bomb").
Also are we talking about players who will be new to the grading list? There will be players who only play a handful of games a year or a single Congress. You can convert them to paying for the ECF with an annual fee, but that does nothing to enhance the general size of the chess population.

Ian Thompson
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by Ian Thompson » Tue Oct 08, 2019 1:15 pm

Angus French wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 11:13 am
2. What exactly is the remit of the Development Officer? My understanding, from the Challenges for English Chess paper (see p3 under 'Grow the Membership Base') was that it included increasing membership *above* the 500 new members a year the Board was already planning for. However, the announcement in October's newsletter referred to 'Driving forward the ECF’s plans for increasing its membership base by 500 or more per year' which reads to me as implementing the Board's original plan, not as encouraging extra memberships beyond the original plan. Also, what types of membership are we talking about - presumably not free memberships and ideally more youngish adult memberships in particular (to address "the demographic time bomb").
If the Development Officer is to be paid bonuses for increases in membership above 500 isn't it implied that he first has to get 500 members? The concern would be that the Development Officer doesn't qualify for a bonus if the ECF gets more than 500 new members, but other than through the Development Officer's efforts, although I don't know how you'd determine that had happened.

I don't see a problem with the Development Officer recruiting lots of new members with free memberships. Whilst the benefit to the ECF might be questionable until you find out whether or not they continue as paid members in future years, the Development Officer doesn't get a bonus for recruiting them - the paper you refer to says the bonus comes out of the individual's membership fee so free membership means no bonus payment for that member.

David Sedgwick
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by David Sedgwick » Tue Oct 08, 2019 2:41 pm

Michael Farthing wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 10:15 am
J T Melsom wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:51 am
David Sedgwick wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:02 am
Can you give chapter and verse for that, please?
You have admitted in previous exchanges to having implemented relatively modest initiatives whilst spending much of your time defending the status quo in a manner similar to Canute. I don't have chapter and verse but I doubt my representation of your position is unfair, and is comfortably within the same parameters as the suggestion of a conspiracy to mislead Council.
Well with spin like that you have missed your vocation. You should be in politics. I particularly like "relatively modest initiatives" becoming "not implementing a significant policy in his life".
Michael, many thanks for your support. I am now going to move on.

David Sedgwick
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by David Sedgwick » Tue Oct 08, 2019 2:43 pm

Michael Farthing wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:14 am
What I can get excited about is the actual appointment of Carl Portman which has lifted my spirits and given me hope that my analysis was wrong. I believe he is a very good choice and I wish him every success in his endeavours.
Where is the like button?

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Tue Oct 08, 2019 5:57 pm

"Where is the like button?"

How many times would it be needed?

J T Melsom
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by J T Melsom » Tue Oct 08, 2019 7:04 pm

I've read the note produced by Angus French for Bronze members and without agreeing with everything I think this is a useful document and suggests he takes his role seriously.

I share his concern at the absence of any election address from the candidates. I recall there were also gaps in this regard last year. Whilst any election address might not necessarily be wholly truthful, the candidates are not necessarily known to significant numbers of the electorate. It would be a pity given that these are un-contested elections if the absence of satisfactory engagement with the electorate prompted people to vote for none of the above. but it is not satisfactory to be asked to endorse a stranger. I wonder if something needs to be done about this.

Andrew Zigmond
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Tue Oct 08, 2019 11:31 pm

J T Melsom wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 12:25 am
There is scrutiny and there is scrutiny. Unfortunately there are those who frequent the internet and don't know the difference. Its very much a matter of degree. A slight and debateable error on the part of the Board doesn't mean a free for all with the criticism of that error. It is important that organisers are held to account, but they should also be given the benefit of the doubt. And that along with the odd word of praise are lacking in the contributions from many posters. Do people really believe that unrelenting negativity gets you a better ECF or just a thicker skinned one?

There are unrelenting critics and there are also those who criticise isolated decisions sometimes with merit but the cumulative effect is perhaps missed by many people.
The thread has moved on but sometimes a post needs applauding and this is one of them. The ECF said they were going to appoint a development officer and now they have appointed one - and one of the relatively few individuals with a proven track record.
Controller - Yorkshire League
Chairman - Harrogate Chess Club
All views expressed entirely my own

NickFaulks
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Oct 09, 2019 11:33 am

J T Melsom wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 7:04 pm
I share his concern at the absence of any election address from the candidates.
Me too. In my own case, I had for some time considered trying to join the Finance Committee, but it was only at a late stage that I gained the impression that what was really needed at this point was a Chairman, and then only at the last minute, having done some due diligence, concluded that I could take on the role.

By the time I realised that it might be benificial, although not required, for me to lodge an election address, the deadline had passed. It would in any case be a very simple thing, and if asked I shall make a statement to Council along the following lines.

"I am not an accountant by trade, but have spent much of the past forty years analysing sets of accounts and business plans relating to various enterprises which I have owned, contemplated owning or done business with. I have always considered ECF's finances to be quite straightforward and do not expect to encounter any financial issues of a type which I have not seen before.

If elected I would look forward to working closely with the Board, in particular the Finance Director, building on what I believe is already the good relationship I have with them."

David Robertson
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by David Robertson » Wed Oct 09, 2019 3:04 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Wed Oct 09, 2019 11:33 am
If elected I would look forward to working closely with the Board, in particular the Finance Director, building on what I believe is already the good relationship I have with them
The role requires a commitment to independent scrutiny. It's not a frigging chumocracy!

NickFaulks
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Oct 09, 2019 4:48 pm

David Robertson wrote:
Wed Oct 09, 2019 3:04 pm
The role requires a commitment to independent scrutiny. It's not a frigging chumocracy!
Fair point. I shall, if elected, try to suppress my normal uncritical attitude.

Roger Lancaster
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Re: Council Papers are out

Post by Roger Lancaster » Wed Oct 09, 2019 4:53 pm

David Robertson wrote:
Wed Oct 09, 2019 3:04 pm
NickFaulks wrote:
Wed Oct 09, 2019 11:33 am
If elected I would look forward to working closely with the Board, in particular the Finance Director, building on what I believe is already the good relationship I have with them
The role requires a commitment to independent scrutiny. It's not a frigging chumocracy!
Having a good relationship with someone isn't incompatible with examining his or her work objectively.

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