My Resignation

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
Alex Holowczak
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Re: My Resignation

Post by Alex Holowczak » Thu Feb 02, 2012 1:24 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:However you define membership, whether by organisation or individual, directors are spending other people's money. It's very possible that other people will demand a say in how their money is spent. If you are a director or manager of a national organisation dependent on fund raising from participants, it's an issue you have to live with, however annoying it might be.
The other people will of course get a say in how their money is spent. They get to vote for or against the candidates for Board positions. I would imagine this is how the vast majority of companies in the world work.

An example of this is the British Darts Organisation. They have an ECF-like structure, in that counties affiliate to it. In 1993, the top professionals left the BDO to seek fame and fortune in what became the PDC, which had no such structure. Twenty(ish) years later, the PDC professionals have about twice as much money per event to play for as their BDO equivalents, twice as many events to play in, and far more lucrative sponsorship and television deals. The standard of play in the PDC is also about 5 points per three darts higher than the BDO in the top 64 of the rankings.

Barry Hearn was the catalyst of the PDC. He's become the catalyst behind the recent revival in snooker's fortunes. By changing it to allow him more power to do his job (without consulting via intermediate bodies), the sponsors have increased, the number of rankings events have trebled, and the game is far more global than it was even three years ago.

If you want to run a governing body successfully, Steve Giddins is right that the current structure does not allow for it to happen.

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: My Resignation

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Thu Feb 02, 2012 1:38 pm

Does Barry Hearn play chess?

John McKenna

Re: My Resignation

Post by John McKenna » Thu Feb 02, 2012 1:44 pm

Maybe not but he knows a man who did - Steve Davis.

John McKenna

Re: My Resignation

Post by John McKenna » Thu Feb 02, 2012 1:55 pm

Seem to recall that RDK said that if he couldn't be World Champ he would like to emulate Howard Staunton's 1851 feat of organising the greatest chess event.
To be fair he and the Times were instrumental in bringing the Kasparov-Short WC match to London so he did it.
With the coming of fellow celeb CJ as president he may have thought this is the time to try a comeback in the organising arena.

Neil Graham
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Re: My Resignation

Post by Neil Graham » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:07 pm

Alex Holowczak wrote:
Roger de Coverly wrote:However you define membership, whether by organisation or individual, directors are spending other people's money. It's very possible that other people will demand a say in how their money is spent. If you are a director or manager of a national organisation dependent on fund raising from participants, it's an issue you have to live with, however annoying it might be.
The other people will of course get a say in how their money is spent. They get to vote for or against the candidates for Board positions. I would imagine this is how the vast majority of companies in the world work.

An example of this is the British Darts Organisation. They have an ECF-like structure, in that counties affiliate to it. In 1993, the top professionals left the BDO to seek fame and fortune in what became the PDC, which had no such structure. Twenty(ish) years later, the PDC professionals have about twice as much money per event to play for as their BDO equivalents, twice as many events to play in, and far more lucrative sponsorship and television deals. The standard of play in the PDC is also about 5 points per three darts higher than the BDO in the top 64 of the rankings.

Barry Hearn was the catalyst of the PDC. He's become the catalyst behind the recent revival in snooker's fortunes. By changing it to allow him more power to do his job (without consulting via intermediate bodies), the sponsors have increased, the number of rankings events have trebled, and the game is far more global than it was even three years ago.

If you want to run a governing body successfully, Steve Giddins is right that the current structure does not allow for it to happen.
When this topic crops up, I expect to see this argument wheeled out ad nauseum. Darts, Snooker and Bowls all made great advances because of television coverage and sponsorship followed that. The key with all these games is that they are all visual, the rules are easily understood in a matter of seconds and consequently they lent themselves easily to prime-time coverage. Chess will never be able to follow suit as it is cerebral, complicated and non-visual. I have sat through dozens of ECF Board meetings as successive Marketing Directors have tried and failed to come up with any meaningful sponsorship or television coverage. In addition to this, Snooker and Darts at least have a large helping of "celebrity" players always willing to play to the gallery; compare and contrast with any top chess players. There is absolutely no way that Barry Hearn, Alan Sugar et al are going to either sponsor chess or step in as a Chief Executive.

When chess was on television, what did we get? The great Raymondo wheeled out, like an upmarket John McCririck, with some lesser mortals to expound and sometimes explain the games. Can you think of anyone less likely to encourage people to play chess?

The ECF has rightly (or wrongly) elected CJ de Mooi as its President. As we can see from these forums, the risks of this appointment have proved manifold. The Federation has a stark choice - either to elect a "name" such as CJ or Steve "Boring" Davis as President or go back to the situation where someone from within the chess hierarchy is appointed and they suffer the fate of Gerry Walsh and others.

This piece was entitled "My Resignation" by Alex McFarlane and has now encompassed "My Resignation" by Andrew Farthing and before the next EGM will probably include several more of the same. I have commented previously of the dearth of people actually willing to take on responsibility within the ECF; this thread and others like it will hardly encourage people to come forward to act as volunteers.

In an ideal Alex Holowczak world, the ECF would have an income of millions and be run by a chief executive and board with sweeping powers to modernise, invest and make decisions. Unfortunately as Andrew Farthing's posts have shown nothing could be further from the truth. The USA has been blessed with Johnny Cash, Bob Hope and Stevie Wonder, as we can see the ECF has no cash, no hope and no wonder!

Jonathan Bryant
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Re: My Resignation

Post by Jonathan Bryant » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:28 pm

Andrew Zigmond wrote:Does anybody know what the consensus is on this issue amongst chess editors and journalists (I'm thinking primarily of Malcolm Pein at Chess Magazine but there are others). If any of them feel (as anybody with any sense would) that Lara has been badly wronged then maybe we should ask them to break their silence?
It is a great pity that you have to ask the question, and, I would suggest, a poor state of affairs that chessplayers should have to ask their magazines to cover major issues such as these. I'm afraid neither the BCM nor CHESS have covered themselves in glory with their (almost total lack of) coverage of the fallout from Sheffield and the financial questions that hang over the tournament.

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John Upham
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Re: My Resignation

Post by John Upham » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:58 pm

Jonathan Bryant wrote:
It is a great pity that you have to ask the question, and, I would suggest, a poor state of affairs that chessplayers should have to ask their magazines to cover major issues such as these. I'm afraid neither the BCM nor CHESS have covered themselves in glory with their (almost total lack of) coverage of the fallout from Sheffield and the financial questions that hang over the tournament.
Jonathan,

The february Media News section makes reference to this saga. BCM would like to print more detail when we establish the actual facts rather than the assumptions of facts. Our legal team is ready and waiting to analyse the copy.

In a previous post there is mention of "celebrity". Surely a celebrity is someone who should be celebrated? Is this true in this case?
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Ernie Lazenby

Re: My Resignation

Post by Ernie Lazenby » Thu Feb 02, 2012 3:27 pm

Regarding finances at the last British and seemingly unanswered questions raised by people who are in a position to know; surely there must be a proceedure whereby these can be properly addressed and if obstacles are put in the way preventing the truth/facts from emerging then I am sorry but there is another body of professionals who are more than able to look into such matters. :wink: It seems an age since we were promised openess and transparency. Surely those attending a finance meeting are able to ask relevant querstions and get proper answers.

Regretfully it seems we followed a campaign to get rid of one President to be saddled with one who in some respects is worse than the last one. :oops: (promosing things and then doing another- going Awol at a difficult time- failing to provide leadership.)

Perhaps its time to find a team of level headed staid individuals who have no personal agendas to follow and says it as it is in plain language.. The current board has no kudos none at all but at the end of the day we the chess players are responsible through a general lack of apathy amongst the rank and file. 'We only want to play chess' they say. That attitude results in loose cannons prevailing.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: My Resignation

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu Feb 02, 2012 5:29 pm

Ernie Lazenby wrote:Regarding finances at the last British and seemingly unanswered questions raised by people who are in a position to know; surely there must be a proceedure whereby these can be properly addressed
It starts with what should be routine book-keeping. This enables the Battle office, the ECF's Finance Director and the auditors to eventually prepare and sign off the ECF accounts, of which the Congress is a part, as true and fair. The managers at Sheffield would have had years of experience of both the British and other similar events, and if they're alarmed by the process used, you shouldn't ignore their concerns.

Ernie Lazenby

Re: My Resignation

Post by Ernie Lazenby » Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:09 pm

Exactly so, why then has no one seen fit to call an EGM or have we arrived at a situation whereby the Board are accountable to no one.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: My Resignation

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:28 pm

Ernie Lazenby wrote:Exactly so, why then has no one seen fit to call an EGM or have we arrived at a situation whereby the Board are accountable to no one.
EGM's cost money, both to the ECF and the participants. If the ECF board cannot or will not answer questions, what assistance does an EGM give to the discovery process? The next scheduled meeting is the Finance Council in April. The Board are accountable in theory to Council, but in the absence of motions to remove Directors from office, what can the average league, county or Congress delegate actually do?

E Michael White
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Re: My Resignation

Post by E Michael White » Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:50 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:what can the average league, county or Congress delegate actually do?
Pass a motion requiring the board to issue more interim financial statements.

These need not be statutory statements but should cover whatever headings players require. eg (a) general quarterly - income collected/outstanding etc (b) British Champ - 1st Jul : income and outgo budgeted/expected, additional sponsorship received (JRT, external non-charitable, external charitable ) etc 1st Sept : Actual expenditure, amounts promised but yet to be received etc

Ernie Lazenby

Re: My Resignation

Post by Ernie Lazenby » Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:58 pm

Roger in reply to your last post;Then redress can only be through an outside agency? If nothing is done to answer questions raised by the Congress mangers at the British it seems to me we are in a poor state and in effect lets the board members do whatever they want when they want. ( Taking legal action aginst FIDE is one example)

Sadly we get what we ask for; we wanted changes, pushed for them and are now finding what we had before was probably a whole lot better. Regretfully I see nothing on the horizon to help me believe our federations is going to get better any time soon and is rapidly becoming an irrelevance. Wish we could have a national grading system run by someone else and thus we the grass root players would have no need of the ECF. A national organisation with Kudos it is'nt.

Ernie Lazenby

Re: My Resignation

Post by Ernie Lazenby » Thu Feb 02, 2012 7:01 pm

E Michael White wrote:
Roger de Coverly wrote:what can the average league, county or Congress delegate actually do?
Pass a motion requiring the board to issue more interim financial statements.

These need not be statutory statements but should cover whatever headings players require. eg (a) general quarterly - income collected/outstanding etc (b) British Champ - 1st Jul : income and outgo budgeted/expected, additional sponsorship received (JRT, external non-charitable, external charitable ) etc 1st Sept : Actual expenditure, amounts promised but yet to be received etc

|In theory fine but as Martin Regan found out trying to get Council to do the right things is ni on impossible with the set up we currently have. Too many evening phone calls and favours being called in.

Alex McFarlane
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Re: My Resignation

Post by Alex McFarlane » Thu Feb 02, 2012 7:11 pm

Regular and prompt publishing of minutes of meetings (Council and Board) would be a huge step forward. If this occurred then the court case against FIDE would have been known and Andrew wouldn't have had to apologise for forgetting to put it on the agenda or mention it at other meetings.

It would also make Directors more accountable - at the very least we would know how many meetings they attended.

Is it really too much to expect one member of the Board to take responsibility for ensuring minutes are made available?

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