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Paul Cooksey
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by Paul Cooksey » Thu Nov 28, 2019 7:36 pm

TimWall wrote:
Fri Nov 22, 2019 6:25 pm
Today I received a fundamentally flawed ruling by the Complaints Panel, and I intend to appeal. This matter is not over by a long chalk.
This makes me reluctant to comment in detail still. But, my first impression of the report is it is impressive and the ECF owes thanks to the appeals committee.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by JustinHorton » Thu Nov 28, 2019 9:18 pm

Paul Cooksey wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 7:36 pm
my first impression of the report is it is impressive
Mine is a little different, though as I really don't have a dog in this fight I am not terribly exercised about this.
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Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:15 pm

"These are extremely serious allegations against individuals with impeccable business records"

I really wish they wouldn't say things like that - it's the typical "How dare you complain!" comment that probably/possibly infuriates people other than me. In general, it seems on the face of it a sensible report, and it has (presumably) been published in full. Things seem to have moved on in the last 25 years.

I would certainly agree that ECF need a good proof-reader.

But I offer no comment on the dispute itself. I await the play and the TV mini-series.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by JustinHorton » Fri Nov 29, 2019 12:21 pm

Kevin Thurlow wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:15 pm
"These are extremely serious allegations against individuals with impeccable business records"

I really wish they wouldn't say things like that - it's the typical "How dare you complain!" comment that probably/possibly infuriates people other than me.
Well yes. It's not that there's anything wrong with the statement, it's that it's out of place in a report which should be making findings of fact. (Similarly, the casting of aspersions on the Complainant's motives, whether one agrees with that assessment or not.)
Last edited by JustinHorton on Fri Nov 29, 2019 11:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Paul Cooksey
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by Paul Cooksey » Fri Nov 29, 2019 12:58 pm

Difficult to stop commenting when you start, isn't it?

I don't want to pretend I am an expert. But to my understanding courts do consider good character relevant when dishonesty is alleged. You can submit evidence to that effect. So, I think if someone alleges a personal relationship between two people is enough to assume conspiracy, comments on good character are relevant.

In the sense this appeal is at least quasi-judicial, I thought good character highly relevant to the point someone staying overnight at someone else's house could be taken as a pf indication of a conspiracy having taken place between them.

To be honest, I am reaching the point where if the challenge to this report is lack of independence or conspiracy, it would seem to me implausible. But since reaching that conclusion makes me regard Tim as a vexatious claimant, and I did not want to form that conclusion until he had explained why he considers this ongoing

Paul Robson
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by Paul Robson » Fri Nov 29, 2019 9:39 pm

Having read everything and to be very frank it appears rather obvious what has gone on here..or rather what appears to have gone on . As those that know me I am a very straight talker .
First I should say that I know both Carl and Tim at a personal level and no doubt the shame of all this is it will have left a sour taste in both their mouths . Both have done a lot for chess and have worked hard to invoke interest in the game .i suspect either could do a very good job .
The early lack of transparency is clear and as Kevin T said. I too have never taken an acceptance letter to a job interview ... come on Carl ..I know it’s covering off stuff but very naive and doesn’t look right . We all know in job interviews it’s sometimes a nudge, nudge, wink, wink prior to the interviews and why should the ECF be any different , although it’s never going to be admitted I would bet the shirt off my back on this one !
Now because Tim has a grievance people and wont go away and he will be perceived as an annoyance and the powers will be saying we have looked this ....but looked at without bias ? 🤔
I also think the ECF have missed a trick . Give both an area and see what results ensue that way both Carl and Tim will be working full out to prove their worth ..but alas you have quickly drawn up a contract with Carl despite the long timescales it normally takes to do anything else 😂😂😂 .i will leave it at that .

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Fri Nov 29, 2019 10:19 pm

"The early lack of transparency is clear and as Kevin T said. I too have never taken an acceptance letter to a job interview"

Actually, I was quoting somebody else... I did say that it was reasonable to take along a document saying what you would do if you got the job. The report in this case said the interviewers didn't look at it.

I have had a number of interviews where it was obvious that the decision had been made already (sometimes in my favour, sometimes not). Did Tim Wall get that impression?

I was also surprised there were only two interviewers.

Paul Robson
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by Paul Robson » Fri Nov 29, 2019 11:25 pm

i spoke to Tim the week before his interview so I know the answer. I think you can hazard an educated guess Kevin . I won’t post here but I will be at the London Classic next week and will be happy to enlighten you further if your around.

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Carl Portman
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by Carl Portman » Sat Nov 30, 2019 10:47 am

We all know in job interviews it’s sometimes a nudge, nudge, wink, wink prior to the interviews and why should the ECF be any different , although it’s never going to be admitted I would bet the shirt off my back on this one !

Paul - Can I be absolutely crystal clear on this. Are you saying that in your opinion I was given the nod that I would get this job beforehand. Are you actually saying that?

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Carl Portman
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by Carl Portman » Sat Nov 30, 2019 11:39 am

Paul Robson wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 9:39 pm
We all know in job interviews it’s sometimes a nudge, nudge, wink, wink prior to the interviews and why should the ECF be any different , although it’s never going to be admitted I would bet the shirt off my back on this one !
..because if you ARE saying that Paul then that is actionable. That is actually libel. I have personally said that did not happen. The independent report said that did not happen and you are questioning my integrity and that of the others involved. In effect calling us liars. I cannot accept that. How many years have you known me? If you are saying that it was 'nudge nudge, wink wink' after I have refuted it then shame on you Paul - a person I have known for many years. If you do not retract that statement I (perhaps along with the others implicated) would consider legal action, it is that disgusting to me. I am genuinely shocked by your statement. My reputation has always been (to my knowledge) impeccable in the chess world and your comments really are derogatory. I will give you the opportunity to retract them.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by JustinHorton » Sat Nov 30, 2019 2:14 pm

Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his libel writ for his friends
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"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

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Carl Portman
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by Carl Portman » Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:30 pm

Justin Horton - when there is a bad word to be had you'll find his snout deeply embedded in the trough. Clearly one of life's snipers from the wings he dislikes me because I would not answer his questions whilst the ECF investigation was on. The man once accused of cheating by Chess.com he was frustrated that he apparently had no chance to clear his name. Annoying isn't it Justin? Just keep preaching from your chair sunshine, you make me laugh. I knew you would be first to post (negatively of course) and just won £10 on the bet. Cheers, keep them coming.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by JustinHorton » Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:51 pm

Carl Portman wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:30 pm
he dislikes me because I would not answer his questions whilst the ECF investigation was on.
Well, Carl, I asked you while it was on, you said you wouldn't while it was on, I then asked you again when it was over and you then refused.

Accuracy is a virtue.
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

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Paul Robson
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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by Paul Robson » Sat Nov 30, 2019 9:08 pm

Hi Carl , Sorry to take a while to reply had a surgical procedure today. Just to clarify I was not inferring any candidate was party to anything so apologies if you picked it up that way. I regard both you and Tim to have integrity. I was simply pointing out how it reads to me. Perhaps I should have said “with job-interviews”,Rather than “ in job interviews as that’s what I meant. But if there has been a totally independent review to the full satisfaction of yourself,Tim and others then that’s fine. I am also not going to fall out with you over it ,(and hope your not with me) .
In answer to your question above and to be crystal clear as requested .. No that is not what I was saying Carl

Happy discuss or clarify further if needed

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Re: Complaint to ECF Board about CEO Mike Truran re. Development Officer appointment

Post by NickFaulks » Sat Nov 30, 2019 11:34 pm

Carl Portman wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:30 pm
I knew you would be first to post (negatively of course) and just won £10 on the bet.
Who took the other side?

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