English Chess Forum

I have enquired as to being able to attend the ECF AGM as an observer as League Secretary of the Berkshire Chess Association.

The response was that this would not be possible.

I was under the impression that observers would be permitted.

J.

This is a slanted view of what happened.

You asked to have an observer from British Chess News and this was refused on the basis that Council meetings have never been open to the Press and that I would not change this except with the express consent of Council.

At this point you then suggested the League Secretary of the Berkshire Chess Association without supplying any reason why that individual wished to attend. I took this as a piece of game play by you and stood by my original decision.

I have allowed three requests for observers, one of whom is the Minute Taker to the Board and who has also offered to help with meeting organisation. The other two are senior local officials who have asked to join as they are considering taking up the role of being a Council representative and both had the explicit support of their current Council representatives. They have both been restricted to Zoom access only. I am circumspect about having observers without a convincing reason for attendance since even if joining by Zoom and without video this clutters the Participants list and gallery view making an overview of the whole meeting more difficult.

Nevertheless, I am in favour of making Council Meetings more accessible but will only do so if I can carry Council with me and if appropriate means of achieving this are developed. My 'expert advisors' are confident that this is achievable.

If the League Secretary of the Berkshire Chess Association wants to attend, does he need to give a reason? What kind of an A.G.M. is this?

John Townsend wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 15, 2021 8:37 pm

If the League Secretary of the Berkshire Chess Association wants to attend, does he need to give a reason? What kind of an A.G.M. is this?

It is an AGM where member organisations are represented by single individuals advised by those organisations to the ECF. Observers are permitted at the discretion of the Chair. Michael Farthing has fully explained the reasons for agreeing to observers and also his aspiration to widen access in future. John Upham's request first as rep of BCN and only subsequently wearing a Berkshire hat, didn't satisfy the criteria for attendance. I don't think Michael Farthing's time and energy should be wasted further on this matter - his activity on behalf of the English Chess Federation undertaken with great care, takes up more than enough of his time already. We should be more appreciative of his efforts, particularly on the eve of what may be an especially testing meeting.

If someone were given one proxy vote, are they eligible to attend?

If a member of the ECF wants to attend, is there anything objectionable in this? Are they not entitled to attend even if they cannot vote?

Adam - I am simply reporting the decision. Michael suggested access might be widened going forward, but there are logistics to consider in the mix. A proxy holder would normally be in attendance as representative of another organisation, or replacing the usual attendee - i don't think you can split a single organisation into multiple voters. I think those standing for election are also allowed to attend. But do you really want ECF meetings to be subject to the sort of tactics deployed to gain admission to the AGMs of large corporations?

I think that any member of the ECF should be entitled to attend their AGM.

Adam Raoof wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 15, 2021 10:12 pm

I think that any member of the ECF should be entitled to attend their AGM.

Should we hire the Albert Hall?

Berkshire Chess Association who is the rep? ECF may have outside demonstrators. I think that any member of the ECF should be entitled to attend their AGM if paying 10 pounds. I am going to go for a walk, listen to the radio and hope for live coverage on this forum.

I'll try to find out at the meeting

I don't oppose opening up ECF meetings, but it does need careful consideration. Many years ago I was involved in consultation meetings with statutory consultees mainly from local government. One of the local government officers did not realise the meeting attendance was restricted and invited somebody extra. It was very clear from his opening contribution that we were right in our approach. The dynamics of the meeting changed, and the level of debate worsened wasting a fair bit of time. I have also done some open meetings, but those place an additional burden on the capabilities of the Chair. There may well be bad behaviour from attendees tomorrow, I wouldn't want to be in the chair if they brought friends along.

This is the Annual General Meeting. If any paid up member of the ECF turned up tomorrow to attend the meeting, on what legitimate grounds could they be excluded? They may not have the right to speak or vote but they should be allowed to attend.

It would be perfectly reasonable to exclude visitors on the grounds of fairness as the meeting has not been advertised as open. You can't just waive the rules because somebody turns up on the off chance - imagine if it were a dozen or two dozen.

The meeting ultimately makes decisions that affect every ECF member, not least how their membership money is spent. I would support a live stream of the meeting for those who want to watch it.

The attacks on Michael Farthing on this thread are uncalled for; as usual he has simply explained the rules as they stand, together with the practical problems of maintaining order if every ECF member and their dog turned up. It's worth remembering that Covid is still a factor.

I would also point out that it is not inherently difficult to get a place on Council; anybody that desperate can usually find a way. Nor is it that difficult to get a motion on the agenda - you simply have to lobby a few requisitionists to put it forward and then make your case to other member organisations to vote for it.

J T Melsom wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 15, 2021 9:48 pm

A proxy holder would normally be in attendance as representative of another organisation, or replacing the usual attendee - i don't think you can split a single organisation into multiple voters.

Perhaps it needs a little pre-planning, but someone representing a number of organisations whether directly or by proxy should be able to pass on a "ticket" to someone not otherwise entitled to attend.

Past meetings have had observers. Perhaps for obvious reasons attendance this year is restricted.