ECF Rolling Membership

[Ian Thompson]

The number of cases of (b) will be quite small and (in my experience) the ECF applies discretion and waivers in cases where leagues appeal. One obvious case is where a league member dies before taking out ECF membership.

According to the ECF it is "self-evident" that dying is no excuse for not renewing your ECF membership on time and will not result in a waiver of game fee - see the end of Notes on Rolling Membership Year Proposal (2).

[Mike Gunn]

All I can say is that under a previous regime things were done differently with respect to dead ex-members.

[John Upham]

All I can say is that under a previous regime things were done differently with respect to dead ex-members.

And dead ex-parrots from Norway?

[Mike Gunn]

PS In the 1950s a player died at the board in a Surrey league game and the game was adjudicated drawn ... I can't see that happening these days!

[Roger de Coverly]

Somebody with a renewal date in March:

(a) who renews ... is a member in June so no problem

(b) who doesn't renew (e.g. because they have stopped playing) then they won't be a member in June so the the league would become responsible for games played when they were active.

Are you now saying that someone who joins as a Gold or Silver member on 1st March 2023 is covered for Game Fee exemption until 28th February 2024? That seemingly contradicts the statement that a joiner on 1st March 2023 has backdated league rights to the previous 1st September 2022 which expire on 31st August 2023.

Why do I get the impression that the problem raised by Paul Cooksey is not understood? It is a permanent problem because every year the league will need to check that if they are still playing, that they needed to renew their membership.

[Mike Gunn]

Somebody with a renewal date in March:

(a) who renews ... is a member in June so no problem

(b) who doesn't renew (e.g. because they have stopped playing) then they won't be a member in June so the the league would become responsible for games played when they were active.

Are you now saying that someone who joins as a Gold or Silver member on 1st March 2023 is covered for Game Fee exemption until 28th February 2024?

In tournaments: yes.

In leagues: only until June 30th.

Why do I get the impression that the problem raised by Paul Cooksey is not understood? It is a permanent problem because every year the league will need to check that if they are still playing, that they needed to renew their membership.

You need to remind people in September to join the ECF on their renewal date, but you need to check in June that they have done so (as you do now).

If that gives you a permanent headache so be it, but for me it's quite simple!

[John Upham]

The table tennis world in England (!) has a very simple solution which works superbly and creates no confusion or angst:

In order to play in evening league matches every player in the team must be registered with Table Tennis England prior to the match starting.

If not they cannot play and someone else will play instead.

The leagues know this, the clubs know this, the teams knows this, the captains knows this and the players know this.

There is none of this whinging and whining about "What if someone walks into a club off the street (as you do) and wants to play in a league match?"

Well, they can play IF they register and they can do this online on the same evening as they stumbled into the club by accident.

I find this constant nonsense about not being unkind to league chess novices by requiring them to register quite laughable.

We get novices to league TT and they are told to register and then they can play: simple.

[NickFaulks]

You need to remind people in September to join the ECF on their renewal date, but you need to check in June that they have done so (as you do now).

Whose job do you consider this is?

[Mike Gunn]

You need to remind people in September to join the ECF on their renewal date, but you need to check in June that they have done so (as you do now).

Whose job do you consider this is?

The clubs (because in my neck of the woods the leagues pass the charge straight on to the clubs).

[Roger de Coverly]

Well, they can play IF they register and they can do this online on the same evening as they stumbled into the club by accident.

How much do you charge them?

[John Upham]

Well, they can play IF they register and they can do this online on the same evening as they stumbled into the club by accident.

How much do you charge them?

2022/23 season

Seniors: £18.00 (19+)
Cadets / Juniors: £9.00 (under 19)

NB: refunds are only processed within 14 days of purchase or on the production of a medical certificate.

[Dragoljub Sudar]

I wouldn't think many clubs insist on ECF membership before allowing members to apply in league teams, they will (at some point) chase people up to join as they do now. I really don't see the problem here.

This statement demonstrates a lack of understanding of how some, probably many, clubs operate.

Up till now I have been able to simply check whether club members have joined the ECF knowing that the membership will be until 31 Aug.
I can then choose whether to insist that the club member joins the ECF before playing for us in the league. I'm in control.

That has now changed. Although this season I will be able to do the same as last season because everyone's ECF membership will have expired unless they have renewed, next season I will be faced with a whole range of expiry dates, especially for people who join the club during this season.

If someone takes out ECF membership in January 2023, that covers his/her league games for the 2022-23 season. In September 2023 I will make a note that his/her membership expires in January 2024. In January 2024 I can ask him/her to renew and he/she almost certainly will. However, if he/she doesn't then the league becomes liable for £18 (the league will bill the club but the ECF is quite clear it's the league's 'debt', not the club's). I have lost control. I am no longer able to insist in September 2023 that someone is an ECF member for the whole of the new league season.

I assume Mike will be handing out free Paracetamol for all the club officials' headaches.

[Alan Walton]

The table tennis world in England (!) has a very simple solution which works superbly and creates no confusion or angst:

In order to play in evening league matches every player in the team must be registered with Table Tennis England prior to the match starting.

If not they cannot play and someone else will play instead.

The leagues know this, the clubs know this, the teams knows this, the captains knows this and the players know this.

There is none of this whinging and whining about "What if someone walks into a club off the street (as you do) and wants to play in a league match?"

Well, they can play IF they register and they can do this online on the same evening as they stumbled into the club by accident.

I find this constant nonsense about not being unkind to league chess novices by requiring them to register quite laughable.

We get novices to league TT and they are told to register and then they can play: simple.

I have been saying this for years, using my old pool league as an example where you had to be a member of the national federation to participate in the league; and it is quite normal to be a member of the national federation to play competitive matches

I always expected pure novices walking in off the street not to expect to be playing a match straight away the same night; more likely to have a few friendly games, and possibly in the future then become a member with the knowledge of its associated costs

[Roger de Coverly]

I always expected pure novices walking in off the street not to expect to be playing a match straight away the same night;

It's no longer necessarily true that new players are pure novices. They may well have played online extensively, Don't chess clubs have a bad enough reputation for hostility to newcomers without demanding an annual membership fee of the national body as a condition of playing a first "proper" game?

[John Upham]

I always expected pure novices walking in off the street not to expect to be playing a match straight away the same night;

It's no longer necessarily true that new players are pure novices. They may well have played online extensively, Don't chess clubs have a bad enough reputation for hostility to newcomers without demanding an annual membership fee of the national body as a condition of playing a first "proper" game?

As a new comer to TT I was asked to join the ETTA (as it was then) before I could play in a league match.

I did not regard that as a personal affront nor as hostile but merely as part of the accepted process. No umbrage was taken so I have little or no sympathy for the suggestion that newcomers will be offended.

I restarted motorsport this year. My last license was an FIA International B Rally license and was a VIP license (#16) in a reserved group of 100 until recently including Stirling Moss amongst others.

For my first event in 2022, I was required to obtain a Clubman's RS license which was little akin to being back-to-square one. I did not take offence or was my ego bruised in any way, shape or form.

So I'd suggest the possibility of offence being taken was a load of imagined baloney.