October 2023 ECF AGM

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
Mick Norris
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Location: Bolton, Greater Manchester

Re: October 2023 ECF AGM

Post by Mick Norris » Wed Oct 18, 2023 4:13 pm

Better than the first draft, but not good
Perhaps the further key conclusion from this AGM is that the ECF needs to adopt a “one direct member, one vote” system for elections and other key votes to allow full democracy – as virtually every major organisation in the country does. Without this change, the problems with conflicts of interest will persist and may worsen.
Tim polled the Gold members and got just over 150 responses; there are over 2,680 of us

There are over 2,375 silver members, and the silver reps often comment they don't get much feedback

Over 4,100 Bronze members (I'm looking at adult numbers here, not juniors), ditto I guess

I'd like to see OMOV, but the limitations are there for all to see
Any postings on here represent my personal views

John Swain
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Location: Nottingham

Re: October 2023 ECF AGM

Post by John Swain » Wed Oct 18, 2023 6:35 pm

Mick Norris wrote:
Wed Oct 18, 2023 4:13 pm
Better than the first draft, but not good
Perhaps the further key conclusion from this AGM is that the ECF needs to adopt a “one direct member, one vote” system for elections and other key votes to allow full democracy – as virtually every major organisation in the country does. Without this change, the problems with conflicts of interest will persist and may worsen.
Tim polled the Gold members and got just over 150 responses; there are over 2,680 of us

There are over 2,375 silver members, and the silver reps often comment they don't get much feedback

Over 4,100 Bronze members (I'm looking at adult numbers here, not juniors), ditto I guess

I'd like to see OMOV, but the limitations are there for all to see
I'd also like to see OMOV and accept that there are limitations. I think that far more members would be persuaded to vote if they felt that their views were equally important and that there weren't sizeable and self-interested voting blocs dominating the ECF electoral landscape.

Tim Wall and Mike Waddington, the Gold reps, did better than the ECF Board who only persuaded 116 Gold members to respond to their recent survey, even though there was an opportunity for Gold members to reduce their membership fee: https://www.englishchess.org.uk/members ... 24-8-24-9/

As a Bronze member, I was not consulted at all by the reps but I am pleased to note that the one Bronze rep who did vote at the AGM, Gareth Ellis, took his cue from the 60.5% of Bronze members who voted for "no change" (admittedly, a small sample of just 86 responses - of which I was one).

Collectively, Silver and Bronze members constitute the vast majority of ECF members and both groups in the Board's survey supported "no change". This helpful steer was ignored by several AGM voters and Option 2 narrowly prevailed (with some questions over the integrity of the vote already mentioned upthread). This may not encourage members to vote in future polls.

Paul Cooksey
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Re: October 2023 ECF AGM

Post by Paul Cooksey » Wed Oct 18, 2023 8:32 pm

Mick Norris wrote:
Wed Oct 18, 2023 9:17 am
Doncaster rep report
I assume that report from Steve Mann. It is in line with my recollection.

Steve does omit two of the three things you could describe as controversies if you wanted whip up drama, I suppose deliberately because he does not want to himself. Chris Fegan's complaint in a separate thread. The other notable thing the criticisms in the Financial Committees report, and the discussion of Olympiad expenses. I do think that worth coming back to since ECF governance under some strain at the moment.

But the vacancy for a Finance Director that Steve highlights probably is the most important thing. Clearly a role that does need to be filled. But in my opinion having Sarah Longson as NED and Alex Longson as FD is problematic.

I think Simon Brown posted once that in the ECF conflicts of interest need to be managed rather than avoided. Too few people involved for them not to have a range of overlapping responsibilities. So I viewed raising whether Alex Holowczak would be beholden to the UKCC as a cheap shot. But some things are too much.

Alex Longson as FD and Sarah as an executive director I could live with. But different for a NED whose main role requires independence. Sarah's position was that she applied before anyone approached Alex, so any concern should not impact her election. That seemed entirely reasonable. But on the other hand, now she is elected, I think probably we have to exclude him

I suspect Alex would have been a good FD. But the chess community is not short of accountants, I hope we can find one willing to help.

John Reyes
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Location: Manchester

Re: October 2023 ECF AGM

Post by John Reyes » Thu Oct 19, 2023 10:15 am

Paul Cooksey wrote:
Wed Oct 18, 2023 8:32 pm
Mick Norris wrote:
Wed Oct 18, 2023 9:17 am
Doncaster rep report
I assume that report from Steve Mann. It is in line with my recollection.

Steve does omit two of the three things you could describe as controversies if you wanted whip up drama, I suppose deliberately because he does not want to himself. Chris Fegan's complaint in a separate thread. The other notable thing the criticisms in the Financial Committees report, and the discussion of Olympiad expenses. I do think that worth coming back to since ECF governance under some strain at the moment.

But the vacancy for a Finance Director that Steve highlights probably is the most important thing. Clearly a role that does need to be filled. But in my opinion having Sarah Longson as NED and Alex Longson as FD is problematic.

I think Simon Brown posted once that in the ECF conflicts of interest need to be managed rather than avoided. Too few people involved for them not to have a range of overlapping responsibilities. So I viewed raising whether Alex Holowczak would be beholden to the UKCC as a cheap shot. But some things are too much.

Alex Longson as FD and Sarah as an executive director I could live with. But different for a NED whose main role requires independence. Sarah's position was that she applied before anyone approached Alex, so any concern should not impact her election. That seemed entirely reasonable. But on the other hand, now she is elected, I think probably we have to exclude him

I suspect Alex would have been a good FD. But the chess community is not short of accountants, I hope we can find one willing to help.
The issue and Malcolm did mention this is that we going thou government funding and we don’t have a FD? The question is who else will volunteer for the role?

Also maybe the board will asked her to step out of the meeting if it does involve Alex as there is also two other Ned on the board?
Any postings on here represent my personal views only and also Dyslexia as well

John Reyes
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Location: Manchester

Re: October 2023 ECF AGM

Post by John Reyes » Thu Oct 19, 2023 10:17 am

Mick Norris wrote:
Wed Oct 18, 2023 4:13 pm
Better than the first draft, but not good
Perhaps the further key conclusion from this AGM is that the ECF needs to adopt a “one direct member, one vote” system for elections and other key votes to allow full democracy – as virtually every major organisation in the country does. Without this change, the problems with conflicts of interest will persist and may worsen.
Tim polled the Gold members and got just over 150 responses; there are over 2,680 of us

There are over 2,375 silver members, and the silver reps often comment they don't get much feedback

Over 4,100 Bronze members (I'm looking at adult numbers here, not juniors), ditto I guess

I'd like to see OMOV, but the limitations are there for all to see
Just to said on the Tuesday we had the spreadsheet with the current list of responses (132 in total). When it went out and I did not put my stuff in till after the Wednesday
Any postings on here represent my personal views only and also Dyslexia as well

Ian Thompson
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Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2008 4:31 pm
Location: Awbridge, Hampshire

Re: October 2023 ECF AGM

Post by Ian Thompson » Thu Oct 19, 2023 12:09 pm

John Reyes wrote:
Thu Oct 19, 2023 10:15 am
Also maybe the board will asked her to step out of the meeting if it does involve Alex as there is also two other Ned on the board?
That misses part of the point. Part of the NEDs' role is to scrutinise what the Board is doing and raise any issues they find. The question is whether Sarah would raise issues with the Board if they related to the FD when the FD is her husband.

Roger Lancaster
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Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 2:44 pm

Re: October 2023 ECF AGM

Post by Roger Lancaster » Fri Oct 27, 2023 2:58 pm

Ian Thompson wrote:
Thu Oct 19, 2023 12:09 pm
That misses part of the point. Part of the NEDs' role is to scrutinise what the Board is doing and raise any issues they find. The question is whether Sarah would raise issues with the Board if they related to the FD when the FD is her husband.
A case in point might be the concerns raised by the chair of the Finance Committee, who reported in April that "The total (Chennai Olympiad) costs were over budget by a considerable amount, even allowing for the fact that the move to India caused a significant increase in travelling costs".

The management accounts presented in April showed Olympiad costs of £69,533 as against budget of £43,000. In updating his report for the AGM, the FC chair added "There were also expenses associated with visas, to which I can personally attest. However, the overwhelming issue was air fares, coming in at close to £30k. We were shown individual amounts paid and in my judgement these range from moderately high to extraordinarily high. I do not know how these tickets were sourced ...". He pointed out that, having gone to Chennai himself at his own cost, he was probably better-placed than most to comment on what were reasonable travel costs.

I can appreciate that it may be irritating to the executive directors to have issues raised, whether by independent committees or by NEDs, and I appreciate that I'm not necessarily going to be the flavour of the month by raising this, but they're there for a reason. I do not suggest that anything improper, akin to the Keene/Miles saga 40 years ago, happened but it's a fact of life that most people are rather less careful with other people's money than they are with their own. I can see there's a difficulty revealing personal information but, nevertheless, If the FC chair can't get to the bottom of this - and one can only speculate what he meant by "extraordinarily high" - then I'd suggest the NEDs should be asking questions.

LawrenceCooper
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Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:13 am

Re: October 2023 ECF AGM

Post by LawrenceCooper » Fri Nov 03, 2023 9:00 am

https://www.englishchess.org.uk/two-new ... E7aa5f-K3w

POSTED BY: WEBADMIN 1ST NOVEMBER 2023

The ECF is pleased to announce two new director appointments.

First, Alex Longson is our new Finance Director, replacing Adam Ashton. Alex combines his role at UK Chess and running the Delancey UK Chess Challenge (with Sarah Longson) with extensive financial expertise and experience.

Second, we have expanded our group of non-executive directors through the appointment of Katarzyna Toma. Kata will bring her playing and wider international experience to bear when advising the Board and working with the other Directors.

Stephen V Woodhouse
For and on behalf of The English Chess Federation

Paul Cooksey
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Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 4:15 pm

Re: October 2023 ECF AGM

Post by Paul Cooksey » Sat Dec 02, 2023 10:15 am

I'm a bit embarrassed to admit I didn't see this here or the ECF website until the recent board minutes published.

I think I'm ok with the solution the board came up with, as we always note good candidates always have overlapping responsibilities, I'm a bit surprised it was ok for Sarah given what she said at the AGM. But I suppose she had time to reflect on it.

A pity Shohreh stepping down, particularly if indicates she is stepping back from chess generally following her run ins with FIDE, But I think the role was always Director of being Shohreh Bayat, so replacing the vacancy with a NED makes sense.

I'm slightly amused by Malcolm's repeated insistence that the ECF needs strong financial governance given he is the person who most needs governing. But it doesn't mean he is wrong.

Ian Thompson
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Location: Awbridge, Hampshire

Re: October 2023 ECF AGM

Post by Ian Thompson » Sat Dec 02, 2023 11:39 am

Paul Cooksey wrote:
Sat Dec 02, 2023 10:15 am
I'm a bit embarrassed to admit I didn't see this here or the ECF website until the recent board minutes published.
Neither did I, which makes me think it either didn't, or only very briefly, appeared on the ECF website home page.
Paul Cooksey wrote:
Sat Dec 02, 2023 10:15 am
A pity Shohreh stepping down, particularly if indicates she is stepping back from chess generally following her run ins with FIDE, But I think the role was always Director of being Shohreh Bayat, so replacing the vacancy with a NED makes sense.
Where's the announcement of Shohreh Bayat's resignation? Is there one, and, if not, why not? Did she do anything during her tenure?

LawrenceCooper
Posts: 7260
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:13 am

Re: October 2023 ECF AGM

Post by LawrenceCooper » Sat Dec 02, 2023 11:52 am

Ian Thompson wrote:
Sat Dec 02, 2023 11:39 am
Did she do anything during her tenure?
Are you familiar with the Cambridge International Open? She was both tournament director and chief arbiter. She was also very helpful in my dealings with her whilst in the post.