Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
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Gavin Strachan
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by Gavin Strachan » Wed Mar 31, 2010 1:04 pm

On a more serious note you could join the "Adam Raoof for FIDE Presidency" on Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=1 ... 765&ref=ts).

When people say Kirzan I think of Curzon.

matt_ward
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by matt_ward » Fri Apr 02, 2010 2:19 pm

I believe, Karpov should be nominated as the Fide President on the basis; that he is extremely experienced and he has been so successful as a chess player on that basis in contrary to this he has achieved and been playing competitive chess for abosolutely years, in addition I don't actually know much about the other nominee.

matt.

cjdemooi
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by cjdemooi » Mon Apr 12, 2010 8:26 pm

The German Chess Federation has come out with unanimous support for Karpov.

About a month ago, I received what was clearly a form letter asking me for my personal support and that of the ECF. No official decision was reached (despite what individuals' personal preferences might be in preferring a former World Chess Champion to the present incumbent) and it was suggested not to publicly back anyone.

I offered the 'The ECF doesn't support any one candidate over another - it supports FIDE and chess' stance.

May I invite comments please?

Alex Holowczak
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by Alex Holowczak » Mon Apr 12, 2010 9:02 pm

It depends on the point of view:

Is the ECF delegate (Nigel Short) there to make the decision, which the ECF supports?

or

Is the ECF to make the decision, which Nigel Short supports (and votes accordingly)?

If the former, then leave it to Nigel. If the latter, perhaps put it to Council (a bit late for that now, though...).

cjdemooi
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by cjdemooi » Mon Apr 12, 2010 9:14 pm

I discussed it with Nigel and would trust his judgement implicitly.

Should there be a distinction between a vote that is put forward (by Nigel either with or without direction from the ECF) and an official public announcement from the Federation?

Matthew Peat
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by Matthew Peat » Mon Apr 12, 2010 10:21 pm

If Karpov's motives are as he says surely he is worth getting behind.

- Last year the FIDE Grand Prix descended into farce (Nalchik, Jermuk anyone?).
- The showcase tournaments, the World Cup and the Olympiad are being played in one of the remotest places on the earth (Khanty-Mansiysk).
- 2010/2011 FIDE Candidates matches already discrediting the external image of the game by being tarnished with the politics of the long standing Armenia-Azerbaijan conflict
- The zero-tolerance default rule

The only thing FIDE still do relatively well is administer the ELO rating system and they have shown signs of itching to tamper with even that.

My only reservation is that I doubt Karpov's ability to attract sponsorship from the multinational corporations in the way that someone like Kasparov could.

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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by Alex Holowczak » Mon Apr 12, 2010 10:31 pm

But Kasparov isn't interested! Karpov would surely be better at attracting sponsors than Ilyumzhinov. Average man on the street has (just about) heard of Karpov. The only reason all the events are in Khanty-Mansiysk (apart from Turkey) is that he's politically President there, so doesn't have a problem finding a suitable venue.

The Grand Prix was a farce. What intended to be a worldwide event had four events in Russia, one in Azerbaijan and one in Armenia! The same is true of the World Championship. The whole cycle has been marred with changes, and complicated formats that confused even the most stringent followers. From what I read about them at the time, I think FIDE demanded too much prize money for the events, and none of the venues could find sponsorship.

David Sedgwick
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by David Sedgwick » Mon Apr 12, 2010 10:46 pm

cjdemooi wrote: Should there be a distinction between a vote that is put forward (by Nigel either with or without direction from the ECF) and an official public announcement from the Federation?
There are basically three options, are there not?

1. The Board mandates Nigel and makes the mandate public.
2. The Board mandates Nigel, but does not make the mandate public.
3. The Board leaves the decision to Nigel.

Option 3 is the usual choice. Option 2 has been chosen for lesser positions, but not I think for the FIDE Presidency. (However, how could I have known, unless I had been on the Board at the time?)

Option 1 has been chosen three times to my knowledge, in 1982, 1986 and 2006. We supported the losing candidate on each occasion.

I have a lot of sympathy with the view Nigel expressed up thread:
Nigel Short wrote: That said, I will not support anyone, unless I believe he has a chance to win. One eventually grows tired of pissing against the wind, as I have been doing for the last few decades. So for the moment, I will watch and wait.
We mustn't lose sight of the fact that there will also be an important election for President of the European Chess Union. Three tickets are being formed and our decision as to whom to support could well have a bearing on the outcome.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Apr 13, 2010 12:38 am

David Sedgwick wrote:We mustn't lose sight of the fact that there will also be an important election for President of the European Chess Union. Three tickets are being formed and our decision as to whom to support could well have a bearing on the outcome.
Something of a Hobson's choice

There's the Turkish guy who supports both Kirsan and zero default times (and who was part of the anti-Kirsan camp in 2006)
The current incumbent who also supports Kirsan.
The Bulgarian guy who accused Kramnik of cheating and who has been accused of being suspect himself.

Simon Spivack
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by Simon Spivack » Tue Apr 13, 2010 4:01 pm

Poor ECF: can't even hang a man properly.
Stewart Reuben wrote:People seem to be assuming that only Kirsan and Tolya can be candidates. This is untrue. The nominating papers deadline has yet to come. Even then, from my first paragraph, you will note that this would still not prevent another candidate being parachuted in. Thus I will temporarily reserve judgement on which candidate I would support for FIDE President. Of course my only voting right in this matter comes in if the ECF Board decides to mandate Nigel Short to vote in a particular way, as thy did Gerry Walsh in 2006.
It is a question of priorities. I hope everyone reading these fora no longer entertains any illusions of the nature of the current FIDE President. To avoid a split opposition, the ECF should support the first candidate of stature opposed to Ilyumzhinov: that person is Karpov. I don't expect any canvassing from either the ECF or its representative. However, it is reasonable to ask for a statement of voting intentions, to discourage any one else from throwing his hat into the ring. It is disappointing that this even needs to be discussed. If there are repercussions, I, for one, am happy for the ECF to share the fate of the German, French, Swiss and other federations.
cjdemooi wrote:it was suggested not to publicly back anyone
There is some downside for those who occupy positions within FIDE. Not something that greatly concerns me.
cjdemooi wrote:I offered the 'The ECF doesn't support any one candidate over another - it supports FIDE and chess' stance.
A meaningless piety.
Alex Holowczak wrote:The only reason all the events are in Khanty-Mansiysk (apart from Turkey) is that he's politically President there, so doesn't have a problem finding a suitable venue.
If Alex is attempting to say that Ilyumzhinov is president of Khanty-Mansiysk then his recollections differ from mine. Khanty-Mansiysk has plenty of oil. Kalmykia is rather poorer and receives funds from the centre: these monies being administered by the republic's authorities, i.e. Ilyumzhinov.

There are huge problems for Russia in its south, a point bloodily reinforced by the recent metro tragedy in Moscow. This may encourage the Kremlin to support its chosen strongmen. However, there will still be a desire not to allow regional governors to become too confident. Some months ago a federal tax officer was arrested and beaten up by the local authorities, from memory it was in Daghestan. This was to show the limitations of the centre's writ. From the perspective of chess, it is possible that those in power will not be averse to a comparatively minor clipping of Ilyumzhinov's wings. I don't rule out Russian support for Karpov, presumably neither does he.

Jonathan Rogers
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Tue Apr 13, 2010 9:36 pm

I agree with Simon. If those who want to do anything other than to support the person most likely to beat Ilyumzhinov were to be forced to write an open and detailed account of their reasons, they would soon give up. Not a good sign.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:54 am

There's a manifesto statement from Karpov at http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=6256

It's long on words and short on policies. It doesn't for example state that he would reverse the current FIDE board's anti-chess initiatives such as zero time defaults.

One of the bullets is
Turn chess into a modern, professional sport
Does this mean amateur players should be driven away?

That said, if chess were to attract sponsorship from major corporations, an ex-world champion as figurehead has to be better than the president of an obscure Russian republic.

Alex Holowczak
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by Alex Holowczak » Thu Apr 15, 2010 11:17 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:It's long on words and short on policies.
I think that's a thoroughly disappointing manifesto. His policy of not saying anything that might put people off voting for him seems to be one mirrored in modern politics though.

Jonathan Rogers
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Thu Apr 15, 2010 11:48 am

At the (very real) risk of projecting our own desires on a rather bland and non-committal manifesto, we could interpret a promise to listen to the concerns of individual federations as something that will indirectly empower amateurs and lead to a greater willingness to listen to objections on matters such as zero-default times.

Zer0-default times were only introduced because Kirsan was embarrassed in front of some members of the Olympic Committee when they visited an event where one of the games did not start on time. The player who was late was, I seem to recall, Karpov!

Now, it seems that Karpov is a somewhat underwhelming candidate in some senses - but that is still no good reason for the ECF to be neutral, assuming that Kirsan will be his opponent.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Karpov candidate for FIDE president

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu Apr 15, 2010 12:05 pm

Jonathan Rogers wrote:Zer0-default times were only introduced because Kirsan was embarrassed in front of some members of the Olympic Committee when they visited an event where one of the games did not start on time. The player who was late was, I seem to recall, Karpov!
That was right at the start of his tenure as FIDE president as well. So why didn't he raise the issue then?

One of Kirsan's other gripes was that at the start of Olympiads, not all the players were present at the official start of play. A little investigation would have revealed that this was due in part to security measures to gain access to the venues. At Calvia in particular, there were airport style scanners on the way into the building ( a casino in its normal life). As a consequence the open and women's events were given staggered start times to reduce the queues.

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