ECF Membership

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
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Carol Williams
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ECF Membership

Post by Carol Williams » Fri Nov 26, 2010 6:25 pm

Hi All

Are you a member through choice or necessity?
If you are not a member why not?

Mike Truran
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Mike Truran » Fri Nov 26, 2010 6:36 pm

I think most of us have been here before, Carol. See the various threads under ECF Matters.

Carol Williams
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Carol Williams » Fri Nov 26, 2010 6:51 pm

We have been asked by a member of the ECF board as to who is a member through necessity rather than choice so thought it wise to start a new thread - apologies it this is the wrong thing to do

Michael Jones
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Michael Jones » Fri Nov 26, 2010 7:30 pm

I'm not, because I've never entered a league/tournament for which it was required.

Alex Holowczak
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Alex Holowczak » Fri Nov 26, 2010 8:07 pm

Necessity - An ECF arbiter needs to be a member of the ECF. I knew I was taking the exam soonish, and I knew the price was about to go up, so I got in quick!

Mick Norris
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Mick Norris » Fri Nov 26, 2010 8:34 pm

Choice originally, necessity now due to 4NCL North
Any postings on here represent my personal views and should not be taken as representative of the Manchester Chess Federation www.manchesterchess.co.uk

Alan Walton
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Alan Walton » Fri Nov 26, 2010 8:41 pm

Nowadays like the majority of people is out of necessity, due to FIDE ratings

But in the past before the Game Fee, as it wasn't that expensive, so I did it out of choice

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Gavin Strachan
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Gavin Strachan » Fri Nov 26, 2010 9:13 pm

I did it for the cheaper congress fees as it made sense when I entered a lot in a year. Now, I do not, I barely have enough time for team chess at the moment so see little benefit in membership but when things settle down will probably become a member again. Seems little benefit in full membership as opposed to the bog standard one (or whatever it is called) so personally think that either full members should get more benefits and bog standard ones less. One area is to make the online grading database accessible to full members only (I think they do this in Scotland being lazy I can't be bothered to check). It is cheap and cost effective; the ecf incredibly undersells itself and there are certain tasks which are done on a voluntary basis but that very few people could do and most companies pay shed loads for. Running the ecf grading database is certainly one area.

Trefor Owens
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Trefor Owens » Fri Nov 26, 2010 9:26 pm

I am an ECF member because I wanted to play in the recent British (Weekend) and 4NCL

However, I think a more interesting question is:
Why should players who are not members of the ECF be given grades?

I say this as a humble wood-pusher who has paid club fees (and therefore County fees) for the bulk of the last 30 years – my kids preferred judo to chess, but they wouldn’t have been graded without belonging to one of the sport’s Associations (BJA in their case). It seems that chess is a bit of a shambles in comparison, and believe me I think judo grading could learn from chess in some respects!! :)

It just seems that I pay a fee to my club, they pass a fee to the Kent County Chess Association, I assume that the KCCA pass on a fee to the ECF but along the way I am lost as a member. Crazy

Regards
Trefor

Roger de Coverly
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Roger de Coverly » Fri Nov 26, 2010 9:44 pm

Trefor Owens wrote: Why should players who are not members of the ECF be given grades?
In the interests of having as many players graded as possible.

I'll pass on the competitive aspects of Judo, but most of the way that Congress and League chess is organised would be somewhere between difficult and impossible without nearly all players having reasonably reliable grades. As for examples, seeded pairings, board orders and grade restricted events.

Trefor Owens wrote:It just seems that I pay a fee to my club, they pass a fee to the Kent County Chess Association, I assume that the KCCA pass on a fee to the ECF but along the way I am lost as a member.
The Kent County Association is the member of the ECF and gets grading services for people who play in its competitions. The amount Kent pay to the ECF is proportionate to the number of games it organises. How Kent collects from clubs is a matter for the Kent Exec and AGM and different counties have varying approaches.

One of the problems with the ECF's approach to individual membership is that it demands that individuals sign up as guarantor members of the ECF. By this I mean the white form that makes you liable for a pound if the ECF should go into liquidation.

In some parts of the country, we like to try to entice new players into competition chess without trying to put them off by demanding they sign forms and pay money to a remote national body.

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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Alex Holowczak » Fri Nov 26, 2010 10:05 pm

Trefor Owens wrote:Why should players who are not members of the ECF be given grades?
I wonder why players are allowed to play in any ECF competition without being members. I wouldn't expect to be able to play in my local club's championship if I weren't a member of the club.

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IM Jack Rudd
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by IM Jack Rudd » Fri Nov 26, 2010 10:10 pm

Alex Holowczak wrote:
Trefor Owens wrote:Why should players who are not members of the ECF be given grades?
I wonder why players are allowed to play in any ECF competition without being members. I wouldn't expect to be able to play in my local club's championship if I weren't a member of the club.
But presumably your club does not collect revenue from non-members for playing in its tournaments, and so has no reason to let them do so. The same doesn't apply in quite the same way to the ECF.

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Carl Hibbard » Fri Nov 26, 2010 10:31 pm

I am not a member and never have been but then I no longer play chess, but given my position should I?
Cheers
Carl Hibbard

Roger de Coverly
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Roger de Coverly » Fri Nov 26, 2010 10:39 pm

Alex Holowczak wrote:I wonder why players are allowed to play in any ECF competition without being members. I wouldn't expect to be able to play in my local club's championship if I weren't a member of the club.

How many competitions does the ECF run? Only the British Championship Congress, the National Club and the national stages of the Counties Championship. It only partly requires membership for the British given that membership isn't required for the rapidplays and non-ENG players. So on the club championship analogy, it allows members of neighbouring clubs to take part for nothing.

(edit) I could add the British individual rapidplay and the Counties rapidplay - although both are more in the nature of a franchise where a third party runs it using the ECF's name.

Paul Buswell
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Re: ECF Membership

Post by Paul Buswell » Sat Nov 27, 2010 5:40 am

I stopped being a Standard member (if I have the term right) a few months back when not only did the price go up a chunk but ECF also introduced a surcharge for a printed copy of 'ChessMoves'. Not that I particularly value the publication but I strongly prefer print. So higher price and less product at the same time prompted me not to renew: I'd like to support the ECF but that sent out the wrong message.
In practice I don't actually need ECF membership and the loss of Congress entry fee discounts is not material.

PB

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