Resignation Rumours

[David Robertson]

As far as I can understand it, we have a stock of 500,000 and an annual flow thereafter of 100,000 deflated by 10% annually. I calculate this will yield a ten-year stock of c. 850,000 new active chessplayers, aged 6-16, for which competitive provision must be found. This is not a trivial number. It is roughly 11% of all school-children; and probably nearer 15% of all secondary school children. It is twice the number playing football; a population nearly the size of Birmingham.

If these numbers are realised, it will represent rather more than a step-change in young person behaviour. It will represent the biggest social upheaval since rock 'n roll. Young people will be transformed at a stroke from dull-eyed, slack-jawed dolts gawping at celebrity TV or stabbing their friends to quick-witted, thoughtful young citizens eager to contribute to their communities. Within another decade, they will have started their families, reproducing at 1.9 per family to create a new chessplaying stock of 1.7 million. As Chess for Schools will, by now, be fully into its stride, another 800,000 can be added. By 2025, more than 2.5 million new chessplayers will have been created. Truly fantastic!

By now ECF, with its new computerised membership sevice, will have enrolled all of them as members, charging a flat rate fee of £10 in today's prices. That's a healthy £12.5 million annual income; and a 200,000% increase in membership. Gerry Walsh will be able to travel around by Lear jet; Council can meet in Hawaii; and Andrew Martin can have £176.17 for junior development. We won't have seen anything like it since unicorns romped along the beaches of Atlantis.

David Robertson
Atticus CC

[Charles W. Wood]

As far as I can understand it, we have a stock of 500,000 and an annual flow thereafter of 100,000 deflated by 10% annually. I calculate this will yield a ten-year stock of c. 850,000 new active chessplayers, aged 6-16, for which competitive provision must be found. This is not a trivial number. It is roughly 11% of all school-children; and probably nearer 15% of all secondary school children. It is twice the number playing football; a population nearly the size of Birmingham.

If these numbers are realised, it will represent rather more than a step-change in young person behaviour. It will represent the biggest social upheaval since rock 'n roll. Young people will be transformed at a stroke from dull-eyed, slack-jawed dolts gawping at celebrity TV or stabbing their friends to quick-witted, thoughtful young citizens eager to contribute to their communities. Within another decade, they will have started their families, reproducing at 1.9 per family to create a new chessplaying stock of 1.7 million. As Chess for Schools will, by now, be fully into its stride, another 800,000 can be added. By 2025, more than 2.5 million new chessplayers will have been created. Truly fantastic!

By now ECF, with its new computerised membership sevice, will have enrolled all of them as members, charging a flat rate fee of £10 in today's prices. That's a healthy £12.5 million annual income; and a 200,000% increase in membership. Gerry Walsh will be able to travel around by Lear jet; Council can meet in Hawaii; and Andrew Martin can have £176.17 for junior development. We won't have seen anything like it since unicorns romped along the beaches of Atlantis.

David Robertson
Atticus CC

Watch and learn. I take it your not bothering with your 24,000+ juniors, I need to know if your going to help. Don't forget some of them get older than 16 the year after. What plans do you have to get juniors into the adult league?

We do have the full backing of the DfCCS, the figures are based around what we can do as the ECF and what the DfCCS want to see happen. Do you not have faith in your old colleagues back at the office. This project is very much the product of ECF board directors working together.

I've just had 15 Schools Chess Club organisers from the MCA area (10 Secondary and 5 Primary) coming across to see the Bradford Blatherer to get an idea of how to put their school chess clubs together and will be entering local and national events in the new academic year. All the 15 people I met are all going to use the chess sets to make far more than the 20 we ask for. All 15 wanted to put chess forward to the G&T's but we have also shown them the ECM Case Studies so they can see the advantages to other groups down the educational system, like "last warning", Underachievers, etc. The results we have done here with the pilot have given huge returns. Case studies are available to you at any point or any person from any ECF league. All that without chirping, good eh, from a man let down by old DfES civil servants, I just hope your area wasn't spotting SEN's early, you missed one.

[Matthew Turner]

Let me just explain how I think a membership scheme would work and then perhaps there will be less need for some of this fairly wild hypothecation. Lets set the membership at a realistic level, lets say £25 - for this you will NOT get a pen, a scorebook, a grading list, a year book or reduced entry fees. You will get a grade. Many people will not join the ECF, but a core will, as I understand it about 2000 will be require to maintain current revenues, (office) costs will be reduced because the system will be simpler and more efficient. Less people will have grades - oh dear! Tournaments will have to change, the Minor section will now become an ungraded section, but this could include anyone - Grandmaster X could be playing if he or she does not want to join the ECF. I can assure you that this will soon make 'minor' players want to cough up their membership fees. People will not stop playing chess, I will still be able to toddle off to Glastonbury Chess Club and those who don't want to pay £25 to join the National Federation will buy a round of drinks instead and everyone will be happy.

[David Robertson]

I've just had 15 Schools Chess Club organisers from the MCA area (10 Secondary and 5 Primary) coming across to see the Bradford Blatherer to get an idea of how to put their school chess clubs together and will be entering local and national events in the new academic year. All the 15 people I met are all going to use the chess sets to make far more than the 20 we ask for

Amazing, just amazing. I'm currently the MCA Junior Officer, the first to do the job in over a decade or more. I may not be the best Junior Officer in the world but I do my best. And I can tell you frankly, I don't believe any of this. I do not believe you've had 15 school chess club organisers from my area visiting you. I do not believe you can name any of them or their schools, and until you do, I won't believe a word of it. So please name the people so that I can contact them; and/or name the schools. You can do this in a PM, or as you choose. If I'm wrong, and you are right, I'll apologise to the open Forum for my scepticism here, and will resign my MCA Junior Officer position, because in the latter case, it will mean that my efforts in the past two years to encourage school chess development in the MCA will have been completely wrong, that schools have more confidence in you than in me.

So put up the names, and let's see. I'm especially intrigued by the 10 secondary school contacts

David Robertson
Atticus CC & MCA Junior Officer

[Charles W. Wood]

I've just had 15 Schools Chess Club organisers from the MCA area (10 Secondary and 5 Primary) coming across to see the Bradford Blatherer to get an idea of how to put their school chess clubs together and will be entering local and national events in the new academic year. All the 15 people I met are all going to use the chess sets to make far more than the 20 we ask for

Amazing, just amazing. I'm currently the MCA Junior Officer, the first to do the job in over a decade or more. I may not be the best Junior Officer in the world but I do my best. And I can tell you frankly, I don't believe any of this. I do not believe you've had 15 school chess club organisers from my area visiting you. I do not believe you can name any of them or their schools, and until you do, I won't believe a word of it. So please name the people so that I can contact them; and/or name the schools. You can do this in a PM, or as you choose. If I'm wrong, and you are right, I'll apologise to the open Forum for my scepticism here, and will resign my MCA Junior Officer position, because in the latter case, it will mean that my efforts in the past two years to encourage school chess development in the MCA will have been completely wrong, that schools have more confidence in you than in me.

So put up the names, and let's see. I'm especially intrigued by the 10 secondary school contacts

David Robertson
Atticus CC & MCA Junior Officer

I am just digging out the information for you and the legalities of what I can send you at this point. You do have the big three items in place I hope; Child Protection Policy (I can't find it on the web site), CRB's for all coaching staff representing the MCA, and Public Liability Insurance to cover at least £5m (about £120.00 p/a) but hopefully to cover £15m (about £200.00 p/a)?

As for resigning, DON'T! Too many people have done that recently. Its jut a case that many associations have fallen behind when it comes to appealling to councils, and LEA requirements. There are 276 shades of grey and working in ten or twenty schools is ok because its the remit of each school, this is ALL schools in your area so we HAVE TO be up to the councils minimum requirements before you can even get you both to talk to each other. Its nothing to with confidence in one person, its the fact the ECF have been intouch via all the MP's across the country showing the correct paperwork from the on set.

If you don't have one of the big three the LEA, school, or cluster manager would not contact anyway (Read my blatherings and chirpings in the Chess for Schools Thread), as soon as all the big three items are covered I will gladly put you together with all the LEA's contacts we have in each of the areas. BTW if you don't have one of the three you will need to have it in place in 2 months at a maximum if you want to be involved in the project from day one, later on that means work will have already started and you guys will need to catch up. I did mention this to David Farley on the 25/01/08.

As for being the best Junior Officer in the world, no such thing, and the fact you have anything at all is a great step forward because that means you have some experienced people around you and your skills will be vital over the coming year.

AND please, please remember that the ECF/Holloid Plastics is made to get their attention first by giving away 250,000 tournament quality chess sets. If you say "free" to any council department they will prick their collective ears up. (I hope all that is clear, call me if you wish I'm on the Accredited Coach list.)

[Dr Andrew Cula]

Lets charge Charles' kids £5, and Adults £10. We should be rolling in dough.

The ECF can then afford to provide a free bar at all congresses, The number of people taking up chess should skyrocket!

[Charles W. Wood]

Lets charge Charles' kids £5, and Adults £10. We should be rolling in dough.

The ECF can then afford to provide a free bar at all congresses, The number of people taking up chess should skyrocket!

Thats the idea. (not the free bar bit though ) It all comes down to what do we do next, support on the ground is the most desirable way to go as the local association can dictate their future of juniors better than anyone else. The ideas on how to get Primary to Secondry involvement are already piloted and are working well. Tweeks are needed but it does mean information on how to succeed at this point is already available (please understand I am not talking about 10 to 20 schools, we are talking about hundreds in one area). Keeping juniors as they become adults is the trickiest question of all but even then work has begun using other successes and some new thinking.

As for them being Charles' Kids not me I'm afraid its the ECF. I'm just running the project for the ECF.

[David Robertson]

I am just digging out the information for you and the legalities of what I can send you at this point. You do have the big three items in place I hope; Child Protection Policy (I can't find it on the web site), CRB's for all coaching staff representing the MCA, and Public Liability Insurance to cover at least £5m (about £120.00 p/a) but hopefully to cover £15m (about £200.00 p/a)?

When you've finished 'digging', let me know. There can be no 'legalities' about naming the 10 secondary schools that have visited you. They will all be known to me. And of course, I know the chess-playing primaries too. Just the names, any of the names, will do. I'd like to follow things up. If they are keen enough to trek to Bradford, as you claim, they must be keener than they've ever let on before. So I need to know. Not much point them visiting Bradford if we can't get things moving locally as a result.

The Big 3? Yes, I put the first two in place last year, CRB searches paid for by the Council.

I will gladly put you together with all the LEA's contacts we have in each of the areas. BTW if you don't have one of the three you will need to have it in place in 2 months at a maximum if you want to be involved in the project from day one, later on that means work will have already started and you guys will need to catch up. I did mention this to David Farley on the 25/01/08

I'd like to know who your contacts are in the Merseyside LEAs. I wonder if any of the names will coincide with my contacts. I'll be doing some phoning round to check on Monday. Anything, names of course, you can provide before that would be helpful.

Resign? I'm wondering if that will be necessary. Let's await the evidence from you

David Robertson
Atticus CC & MCA Junior Officer

[Charles W. Wood]

I am just digging out the information for you and the legalities of what I can send you at this point. You do have the big three items in place I hope; Child Protection Policy (I can't find it on the web site), CRB's for all coaching staff representing the MCA, and Public Liability Insurance to cover at least £5m (about £120.00 p/a) but hopefully to cover £15m (about £200.00 p/a)?

When you've finished 'digging', let me know. There can be no 'legalities' about naming the 10 secondary schools that have visited you. They will all be known to me. And of course, I know the chess-playing primaries too. Just the names, any of the names, will do. I'd like to follow things up. If they are keen enough to trek to Bradford, as you claim, they must be keener than they've ever let on before. So I need to know. Not much point them visiting Bradford if we can't get things moving locally as a result.

The Big 3? Yes, I put the first two in place last year, CRB searches paid for by the Council.

I will gladly put you together with all the LEA's contacts we have in each of the areas. BTW if you don't have one of the three you will need to have it in place in 2 months at a maximum if you want to be involved in the project from day one, later on that means work will have already started and you guys will need to catch up. I did mention this to David Farley on the 25/01/08

I'd like to know who your contacts are in the Merseyside LEAs. I wonder if any of the names will coincide with my contacts. I'll be doing some phoning round to check on Monday. Anything, names of course, you can provide before that would be helpful.

Resign? I'm wondering if that will be necessary. Let's await the evidence from you

David Robertson
Atticus CC & MCA Junior Officer

On your first point, as your Child proctection policy will point out "Duty of Care of Information is paramount" so saying which schools are involved on a site that the world at large can see this information. Being known to you is fine and I can't see a Data Protection reason to not give this information out to you direct (but still checking that). As for the big three items ALL three will have to be in place before individual names can be passed on, as that is the agreement between the Chess for Schools Project Manager (on behalf of the ECF) and the LEA's agencies.

Which one of the big three are you missing?

I am interested to hear what the job titles of these people you think they would be? (Teasing I know, but for my own extension of understanding on hurdles for the future).

The one thing I will not be doing is publishing names on this forum for obvious reasons.

[Mike Truran]

Charles

It feels like you are (intentionally or unintentionally) somewhat missing the point here. Your credibility is being called into question by somebody who does not believe what you are claiming to have done. There is an important underlying point here as regards the credibility of the person who is supposedly leading the charge on the chess sets project (i.e. you). In essence, if you are not able to demonstrate your bona fides in this small area, why should people believe the various other (and larger) claims that you have been making on behalf of the project?

[Charles W. Wood]

Charles

It feels like you are (intentionally or unintentionally) somewhat missing the point here. Your credibility is being called into question by somebody who does not believe what you are claiming to have done. There is an important underlying point here as regards the credibility of the person who is supposedly leading the charge on the chess sets project (i.e. you). In essence, if you are not able to demonstrate your bona fides in this small area, why should people believe the various other (and larger) claims that you have been making on behalf of the project?

Far from it, I know that my honesty and credibility are being brought into question, but we do need the ground level/good activists to understand that this is going to happen. Sadly I am bound by the limitations put to me by the red tape within the many councils that the MCA (and all the other County associations) covers, and there are quite a few. David will get all the information he has ask for, schools information will be first. When the Big 3 items are covered we can supply the agency information and contacts, and as per the agreement with councils. Then I will be there to smooth over the hand over at a meeting between the two. As will happen in every county that will be taking part.

The interesting bit is that David is about to spend ages running round in circles trying to get the right information, when we have a system of hand over and policy check points in place and agreed with councils. That is one situation that many counties have run down already, now they are working with us to put the right pieces in place first. This is not some slap dash project, most of the procedure is in place and someone may be able to bolt it but it will only damage the project as a whole.

My credibility is quite in tacked, and I have broad shoulders.I am happy to work with all Junior Organisers as and when they are ready. Whether anyone believes me is besides the point, its going to happen anyway.

Question: Why have we never got juniors into chess on a massive scale before? Answer: because we are not ready for us to go as a trusted body, top to bottom, to be able to gain access to every area.

Even the British Land Challenge used the fact that it wasn't using schools (on mass) or wanting to get adult chess organisers into schools so it didn't need to jump through so many hoops. Chess for Schools by defininition does need to gain access to schools.

[Mike Truran]

Well, let's see what David has to say once you let him have what he has asked for. If you're right we can no doubt expect a fulsome apology from him for doubting you.

PS we haven't had an update on the chess sets project for a while yet. How many sets if any have been delivered so far, and what are the plans over the coming weeks?

[David Robertson]

Not much further forward in supplying simple information, are we?

As for the big three items ALL three will have to be in place before individual names can be passed on, as that is the agreement between the Chess for Schools Project Manager (on behalf of the ECF) and the LEA's agencies.

Which one of the big three are you missing?

I didn't say we were missing any of your 'Big 3'. I said two (the last two) were put in place last year. But this 'agreement' you refer to: is it in the public domain? And what are these 'agencies' of the LEAs you claim to be dealing with?

The interesting bit is that David is about to spend ages running round in circles trying to get the right information, when we have a system of hand over and policy check points in place and agreed with councils

I suspect I won't need to spend that much time checking on what will satisfy me about your claims. But why make it harder for me? Tell me the schools in my area who have visited you in Bradford, and I can ask them how they'd like to proceed now. Not very difficult, is it? There are no DPA issues. The DPA covers personal information, not corporate identity.

David will get all the information he has ask for, schools information will be first. When the Big 3 items are covered we can supply the agency information and contacts, and as per the agreement with councils

School names will do fine at this point. Quite what CRB status & PLI has got to do with making contact with teachers supporting school chess clubs is beyond me. Some of those teachers probably play for my club. And what is this 'agency information' you plan to supply?

I am interested to hear what the job titles of these people you think they would be? (Teasing I know, but for my own extension of understanding on hurdles for the future)

How would I know? You claim to have the contacts. Tell me who would know you in the Liverpool LEA; that'll be a start

The one thing I will not be doing is publishing names on this forum for obvious reasons

Oh, I anticipated that. It's why I suggested you should use the PM [private message] facility. I've been waiting patiently

David Robertson
Atticus CC & MCA Junior Officer

[Charles W. Wood]

Well, let's see what David has to say once you let him have what he has asked for. If you're right we can no doubt expect a fulsome apology from him for doubting you.

PS we haven't had an update on the chess sets project for a while yet. How many sets if any have been delivered so far, and what are the plans over the coming weeks?

An apology is not required or expected.

David is a member of the ECF/ English Chess World and in such has seen more projects collapse than see the light of day. His right to question is understandable and correct. I will answer David by quoting his post above. Doubt and trust are two things that are sadly lacking in the federation as a whole, I have found that at every turn you have to prove yourself worthy before trust is established. Even now on the Atticus site someone with the handle "Bradford_Chess" has said that the four teams I put forward last year had players in from the existing league, this is sadly very wrong, I had clear rules from committee to keep me in check. 1. No player from any existing Bradford team from the year before can be used in any of the Academy teams, with two (which became three exceptions) Me, a person who was a board filler I was training up, and the last was a team captain for a team away in another club. This was achieved and worked well, next season is a different story as I need captains and car drivers, but even then I will make sure as many players as possible are new to the league.

As for an update on the Chess for Schools Project, watch this space is the only answer I can give. There will be a post added to the thread as soon as I can say when things are starting. Sorry I can't give you more but the last few weeks have put a few bumps in the road, but I'm hoping that the work put in through that period has levelled things out.

[Charles W. Wood]

Not much further forward in supplying simple information, are we?

As for the big three items ALL three will have to be in place before individual names can be passed on, as that is the agreement between the Chess for Schools Project Manager (on behalf of the ECF) and the LEA's agencies.

Which one of the big three are you missing?

I didn't say we were missing any of your 'Big 3'. I said two (the last two) were put in place last year. But this 'agreement' you refer to: is it in the public domain? And what are these 'agencies' of the LEAs you claim to be dealing with?

The interesting bit is that David is about to spend ages running round in circles trying to get the right information, when we have a system of hand over and policy check points in place and agreed with councils

I suspect I won't need to spend that much time checking on what will satisfy me about your claims. But why make it harder for me? Tell me the schools in my area who have visited you in Bradford, and I can ask them how they'd like to proceed now. Not very difficult, is it? There are no DPA issues. The DPA covers personal information, not corporate identity.

David will get all the information he has ask for, schools information will be first. When the Big 3 items are covered we can supply the agency information and contacts, and as per the agreement with councils

School names will do fine at this point. Quite what CRB status & PLI has got to do with making contact with teachers supporting school chess clubs is beyond me. Some of those teachers probably play for my club. And what is this 'agency information' you plan to supply?

I am interested to hear what the job titles of these people you think they would be? (Teasing I know, but for my own extension of understanding on hurdles for the future)

How would I know? You claim to have the contacts. Tell me who would know you in the Liverpool LEA; that'll be a start

The one thing I will not be doing is publishing names on this forum for obvious reasons

Oh, I anticipated that. It's why I suggested you should use the PM [private message] facility. I've been waiting patiently

David Robertson
Atticus CC & MCA Junior Officer

Hi David

Simple information to you is 6 months (Yesterday) hard slog for me. You are a chess player and organiser, which means you see this project as very Black and White, it is not, I did the same until this project came along. I can make bold statements and try and inform people in a balance manner (I'm a bit rubbish at that bit, I get very excited) but I am not a director, I have bosses to check with. As you will be the first area for me to start the liaison with (I like the idea its with my biggest critic) so we need to look at the procedure for clarifying your details, whether we need to make a list similar to the Accredited Coaches list covering counties with the right policies and insurance in place. Many other questions need to be addressed.

You also ask if this these agreements are in the public domain, well having over 150+ Councils with LEA's means different agreements in different places. The MCA is going to be fun because you have a lot of LEA's with very different expectations and outcomes from the project which means we would have to work together quite a bit.

As for making it harder, I was inferring you were going to make it harder on yourself. I was just going to run through the details first and make sure from the first area/county to start liaising would be as close to perfect as possible laying a foundation for all other counties. The information will be handed over I just need to make sure its done right.

As for the Teachers bit is the where I have had to learn the most myself, I thought the same. I have worked with only a tiny percent of teachers. This is one of the areas where we didn't move along with the changes in schools. The other point is not one person came from Liverpool they were from your outer areas. But I do have a contact in the Liverpool LEA which I will work with you when I have sorted procedure out.

As for agencies, I'm surprised you did know about this. Agencies such as Police, Probation, Youth Service, CDT, Continue, Duke Of Edinburgh, Princes Trust, Colleges, University, etc, there is loads that work with a group of schools here and a group of schools there.

The one thing I can say is when I have put together the right way to move forward (Give me til Wednesday) I will need you to open your mind, because there is a massive amount to learn. If, like so many chess players, you think your right at the start you will not get very far, we will need to think about totally different to what we thought 10 years ago.

I must say one thing, you have got me thinking about this stage at the right time, so thank you. Sadly I will only be working with MCA until we have this right, so your the test bed.