ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
Tryfon Gavriel
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ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by Tryfon Gavriel » Mon May 23, 2011 7:46 pm

Hi all

Given the usage of both Rapid chess (30 minute or thereabout) and Blitz chess for FIDE World Championship Candidates, would it not be possible in the future to have an ECF Blitz rating?!

This might help promote 5 minute tournaments more which are ECF Rated for blitz chess. I think this might help identify more fast intutive players, and it is a different type of game where time pressure and the importance of the initiative and attack is emphasised.

Feedback welcome from all
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by LozCooper » Mon May 23, 2011 7:48 pm

Tryfon Gavriel wrote:Hi all

Given the usage of both Rapid chess (30 minute or thereabout) and Blitz chess for FIDE World Championship Candidates, would it not be possible in the future to have an ECF Blitz rating?!

This might help promote 5 minute tournaments more which are ECF Rated for blitz chess. I think this might help identify more fast intutive players, and it is a different type of game where time pressure and the importance of the initiative and attack is emphasised.

Feedback welcome from all
I can see no reason why not, if we have enough blitz tournaments being played and submiited for grading.

David Sedgwick
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by David Sedgwick » Mon May 23, 2011 11:03 pm

LozCooper wrote:
Tryfon Gavriel wrote:Hi all

Given the usage of both Rapid chess (30 minute or thereabout) and Blitz chess for FIDE World Championship Candidates, would it not be possible in the future to have an ECF Blitz rating?!

This might help promote 5 minute tournaments more which are ECF Rated for blitz chess. I think this might help identify more fast intutive players, and it is a different type of game where time pressure and the importance of the initiative and attack is emphasised.

Feedback welcome from all
I can see no reason why not, if we have enough blitz tournaments being played and submiited for grading.
One thing at a time perhaps. Shouldn't the ECF demonstrate that it can produce sensible and meaningful Standard Play Grading lists twice a year before it thinks about Blitz Grading Lists?

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Adam Raoof
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by Adam Raoof » Tue May 24, 2011 8:34 am

Tryfon - you could probably produce something like this yourself quite easily. Firstly you have to decide what events would go into the rating list, which is probably

British Blitz Championships (not held at present)
1st Thursday Hendon Blitz (12 a year)
Sam Black Blitz (annual)
Greater London Chess Club Blitz (this is tonight!)
Athenaeum Chess Club Blitz

please add other events...

They would have to be of a certain standard - less than 15 minutes pppg, probably 5 minutes or more pppg, using a set of standard blitz rules. If you obliged anyone who wanted their event to be rated to use Tournament Director you could get things going very quickly.
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by Alex Holowczak » Tue May 24, 2011 8:43 am

Adam Raoof wrote:They would have to be of a certain standard - less than 15 minutes pppg, probably 5 minutes or more pppg, using a set of standard blitz rules.
You mean a 60-move game, to allow for those who prefer increments. E.g. 3 minutes plus 2 seconds per move would fit the 5-minute minimum.

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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue May 24, 2011 9:04 am

Adam Raoof wrote: If you obliged anyone who wanted their event to be rated to use Tournament Director you could get things going very quickly.
Tournament Director gives a rating performance for each event and can use either the ECF method or an Elo method. Neither gives you the back end processing which would be needed to consolidate results over a period and produce a definitive list of ratings or grades for publication and to use in the next processing period. You would also be assuming that an existing grade or rating was a suitable starting point for the blitz ones. You also need a method of estimating new players and deciding any special treatment for juniors. If using an Elo method, a rule is needed for k factors. So whilst Tournament Director goes a long way, there would still be issues which have caused the BCF/ECF considerable difficulties over the years.

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David Shepherd
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by David Shepherd » Tue May 24, 2011 9:43 am

Maybe someone (even the ECF) could design a website where blitz results can be entered and ratings calculated (possibly for any results where time limit too short to be rapidplay graded) - entry being password protected.

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Adam Raoof
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by Adam Raoof » Tue May 24, 2011 9:54 am

Tryfon Gavriel is the webmaster of http://www.chessworld.net and has all the tools he needs to produce a rating list for blitz events. It is some work though!
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Steve Rooney
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by Steve Rooney » Tue May 24, 2011 10:12 am

Returning to Tryfon's original idea of promoting the blitz chess format with more events (rather than just focusing on the mechanics of grading) what are the views of Forum members on this?

I'm all for it, and I see some signs that the long-held bias against fast chess has waned in the internet age. some coaches are also now recommending it as part of a training regime. Could blitz help in popularising the game? Certainly if you see some of the excellent video coverage of recent top-level matches, the blitz games (and the rapids) are very watchable and perhaps more likely to appeal to a wider audience.

Today's prospective chess club members, young and old, are quite likely to have some experience of internet chess and may take to blitz tournaments more easily than long-play.

Mick Norris
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by Mick Norris » Tue May 24, 2011 10:41 am

There have been 7 or more usually 8 round Busy Persons events in Greater Manchester for years now - one afternoon, 10 mins pppg

The Saturday afternoon of Bolton Easter is now the only annual one, I think

Grading the event would add extra work, and the inevitable question of whether there would be game fee (if yes, answer will be no thanks)
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Adam Raoof
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by Adam Raoof » Tue May 24, 2011 10:48 am

Mick Norris wrote:Grading the event would add extra work, and the inevitable question of whether there would be game fee (if yes, answer will be no thanks)
No game fee, but all the participants would have to be ECF Members.

;-)

This is something I could see being done by an organisation such as http://www.chessworld.net with the ECF stamp of approval. It would be great publicity for them, and would encourage more events into existence.

How about it Tryfon?
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David Sedgwick
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by David Sedgwick » Tue May 24, 2011 10:59 am

Adam Raoof wrote:
Mick Norris wrote:Grading the event would add extra work, and the inevitable question of whether there would be game fee (if yes, answer will be no thanks)
No game fee, but all the participants would have to be ECF Members.

;-)

This is something I could see being done by an organisation such as http://www.chessworld.net with the ECF stamp of approval. It would be great publicity for them, and would encourage more events into existence.

How about it Tryfon?
The provision of grading services is much the most important ECF function for the ordinary player. Surely the ECF should continue to take full responsibility for its grading lists?

If you simply let someone else get on with it, how are you going to enforce the membership requirement? You could remove the ECF "stamp of approval" but that would make little or no practical difference.

If you really think this is such a great idea, then why not add six monthly Blitz Grading Lists to the (current) six monthly Rapidplay Lists and (soon to be) six monthly Standard Play Lists.

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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by Alex Holowczak » Tue May 24, 2011 11:02 am

I'm not convinced that there's enough blitz chess at the moment. In Birmingham, people still seem to prefer "Lightning" to blitz, for a reason I've never quite understood. I don't enjoy Lightning at all, but I guess that's my problem. Birmingham has a grand total of 0 blitz tournaments. London seems to have about 20. I'd suggest it as a good idea, but I know whose job it'll end up being...

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Adam Raoof
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by Adam Raoof » Tue May 24, 2011 11:11 am

David Sedgwick wrote:
Adam Raoof wrote:
Mick Norris wrote:Grading the event would add extra work, and the inevitable question of whether there would be game fee (if yes, answer will be no thanks)
No game fee, but all the participants would have to be ECF Members.

;-)

This is something I could see being done by an organisation such as http://www.chessworld.net with the ECF stamp of approval. It would be great publicity for them, and would encourage more events into existence.

How about it Tryfon?
The provision of grading services is much the most important ECF function for the ordinary player. Surely the ECF should continue to take full responsibility for its grading lists?

If you simply let someone else get on with it, how are you going to enforce the membership requirement? You could remove the ECF "stamp of approval" but that would make little or no practical difference.

If you really think this is such a great idea, then why not add six monthly Blitz Grading Lists to the (current) six monthly Rapidplay Lists and (soon to be) six monthly Standard Play Lists.
David, you took me far too seriously.
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Scott Freeman
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Re: ECF Blitz rating possibility ?!

Post by Scott Freeman » Tue May 24, 2011 11:34 am

I like the idea of a Blitz grading list, but can see one or two issues such as the ECF membership obligation. There are a few people I know who play in blitz's here but nothing else. Not sure if they would join the ECF just for the priviledge of a grade. Having said that, if they are playing in nothing else, I need a grade for them and having a blitz list would ensure that they had one. In general I would claim to be in favour.

Aside of our Blitz Club Championship (part of our Speed Chess evenings), we do 3 ordinary open blitz events per year (Easter Monday, May Day Bank Holiday and August Bank Holiday) - but would I be allowed to include events such as our Exchange Chess pairs event this coming Bank Holiday Monday? :lol:

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