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ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 4:04 pm
by Mick Norris
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 4:42 pm
by Roger de Coverly
What will happen when my current membership expires?
You will receive a notification telling you that your membership is about to expire. If we have an e-mail address for you, this will be sent by e-mail; otherwise, it will be posted to you.
You will then have the choice of the level of membership at which you wish to renew: Bronze, Silver, Gold or Platinum.
The renewal subscription will be based on a renewal date of 31 August to bring your membership into line with the new fixed ECF membership year (1 Sept – 31 Aug). The prices quoted will be based on the number of months remaining from expiry of your current membership until 31 August. For example, if your membership expires in December 2012, the rates will be 8/12ths of the respective annual subscription, to cover the eight months Jan-Aug 2013.
This doesn't say whether the Paysubsonline.com system will cope with proportionate memberships.
For non-MOs, the league or association will need to pay the ECF in mid-December. One practical solution would be to ask for a deposit of, say, £12 from each player in graded events who is not (and intends not to be) an ECF member. Above £12, the player would be well advised to consider Bronze membership.
I don't see there's any "need" about it at all. If the organisation expects everyone to play at least 6 games, then eventually they will all become members, even if the organisation has to use foul means to achieve this. So the estimate of Game Fee is zero. If the league results haven't been submitted, the ECF has no way of knowing how many games have been played by "yet to be members".
It appears the online system is going to cost the ECF almost £ 1 per £12 membership - see
https://paysubsonline.com/membershipman ... icing.aspx#
3.95% plus 50p
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 5:28 pm
by Carl Hibbard
Looks a different shall we say "level" of site compared to what was mentioned at the AGM doesn't it
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 5:39 pm
by Christopher Kreuzer
Carl Hibbard wrote:
Looks a different shall we say "level" of site compared to what was mentioned at the AGM doesn't it
Could you refresh the collective memory on what was mentioned at the AGM? Was trying to find out when this company started and how long it has been operating. Couldn't find anything on their website, other than contact details for a farm in Hartfield, East Sussex.
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 5:50 pm
by Angus French
Christopher Kreuzer wrote:Carl Hibbard wrote:
Looks a different shall we say "level" of site compared to what was mentioned at the AGM doesn't it
Could you refresh the collective memory on what was mentioned at the AGM? Was trying to find out when this company started and how long it has been operating. Couldn't find anything on their website, other than contact details for a farm in Hartfield, East Sussex.
We were told - actually at the Finance meeting in April rather than the AGM - that cVent would provide and host the software.
I asked the question: "
What will the costs be: a) for adapting the system to meet ECF requirements; b) for hosting; c) for each electronic payment?"
And Andrew Farthing replied: "
There will be an annual charge of £5,000 which will cover both the ad hoc work to adapt the system and electronic payments for up to 20,000 members. There will be an annual hosting charge of £800."
The recent revised budget statement said: "
10. The costs of implementing the online membership system have been reduced by £1,800. This is because after investigating the proposals in more detail the Board decided to use a different provider from that anticipated at the time the budget was drawn up. In addition, the budget had provision for a full year's contract, whereas the contract was signed part way through the financial year."
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 5:58 pm
by Christopher Kreuzer
Thank-you, Angus. I see now what Carl means by different 'level' of site:
http://www.cvent.com/en/company/
https://paysubsonline.com/contact_us.aspx
Presumably the former was offering this:
http://www.cvent.com/en/solutions/membe ... ment.shtml
The latter (paysubsonline) says it is part of 'The Sports Business', which is not this:
http://www.thesportsbusiness.co.uk/
http://www.thesportsbusiness.co.uk/aboutus.aspx
But is this:
http://www.thesportsbusiness.com/index.php
And trying to find out more about that, I ran up against a blank wall.
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 6:04 pm
by Angus French
Membership FAQs wrote:When will the online system be available?
Paysubsonline are in the process of completing some final enhancements to ensure that the system meets the specific needs of the ECF. The ‘live’ date is scheduled for 16 July 2012, although it is possible that we may be able to launch during the preceding week.
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 6:06 pm
by Dragoljub Sudar
Clarification of the actual charges would be helpful as 3.95% + 50p for 10,000 members is considerably more than £5k.
Will the system also charge 3.95% + 50p everytime someone upgrades from bronze to silver etc?
Or has the ECF negotiated a deal wherebye the maximum charge will be £5k regardless of the actual number of transactions?
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 6:28 pm
by Roger de Coverly
Christopher Kreuzer wrote: Couldn't find anything on their website, other than contact details for a farm in Hartfield, East Sussex.
Various blogs come up on a Google search, for instance
http://paysubsonlinemembershipsoftware.wordpress.com/
The current entry is not encouraging
Ever wondered precisely how things are going for your business if you make by using available on the internet program throughout your company’s purchases? Maybe you have expanded weary with handling the business’ single-handedly with no assist associated with scientific improvements throughout business? When you nonetheless really need to convince all by yourself while you’re corporate panel about having your enterprise online, bring to mind many of the advantage that the regular membership software program proposed by PaySubsOnline can provide.
which reads like a Google translate and makes the usual amount of sense.
There's more of the same at
http://paysubsonlineclubsoftware.blogsp ... -done.html
Terms and conditions at
https://paysubsonline.com/ShowTermsAndConditions.aspx
which as Chris noted is
paysubsonline.com (a trading name of The Sports Business),
Is this "The Sports Business"?
http://www.thesportsbusiness.co.uk/
It seems to be part of Chime Communications
http://www.chime.plc.uk/our-companies
which is quoted on the London Stock Exchange, albeit one of the smaller companies
http://www.lse.co.uk/SharePrice.asp?shareprice=CHW
(edit) Chris seems to have shown that it isn't part of Chime Communications. Isn't there some legal requirement to show who you are on your website when you are a company? The ECF certainly does. (/edit)
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 6:36 pm
by Paul Cooksey
I don't want to speculate, beyond echoing the observation that cvent and paysubsonline do appear to be quite different. But it would be useful if we had some clarification why the vendor was changed.
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:08 pm
by Roger de Coverly
The farm itself is home to a number of small businesses.
But the domain itself seems to be this one
http://website.informer.com/Dave+Evans+ ... m+Ltd.html which leads to
http://companycheck.co.uk/company/04377031
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:14 pm
by Laurie Roberts
What I'd like to know is which method of payment ensures the ECF get the most money?
In addition to grading, the ECF provide support for junior chess and English professionals which, as a supporter of chess, I think is a 'good thing'.
I'd like to pay by the method which maximises the ECF's income.
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:26 pm
by Angus French
There's also info at
http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk. The company appears to have changed its name on 22 May 2012 (just over a month ago) from 'HOLIDAY-REUNION.COM LIMITED' and to have been dormant in recent years. It makes one wonder about the pedigree of the software and the make up of the customer base.
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:37 pm
by Roger de Coverly
Also from the FAQ
Access to each member’s profile is controlled by an individual login and password. If a member needs to update any of the information in his or her profile (e.g. to record a change of address or e-mail address), this can be done at any time by using the login and password to access the existing record.
That's a pet hate of a number of people. If you required to use a website that you go to once every three years, how do you recall a login and password? Even if you've told the computer to remember it, you may well have changed computer. So you end up having to write them all down (security risk) or use the same or similar id and password across multiple systems.
e2e4 uses paypal for online Congress entry. They don't bother with login and password ids, rather they accept that you are entering for grading code x and ECF number y and take you straight to the secure server to ask for card details. Something similar was used by Malcolm Pein's organisation for entries to the London Classic.
Whilst there's nothing wrong in a sole contractor or small business (as this seems to be) supplying software as a development project, isn't there an ongoing reliance on being able to put data through the system? Will the ECF have the membership data on its own computers or webspace?
Re: ECF Membership FAQs
Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:45 pm
by Paul Cooksey
Roger de Coverly wrote:So you end up having to write them all down (security risk) or use the same or similar id and password across multiple systems.
In passing, current thinking is that the former is better. The risk of someone breaking into your house to steal strong passwords being much lower than the risk of weak/ shared passwords being compromised online.